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-   -   "Worthiness"... (http://www.cougarguard.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16311)

K-dog 01-29-2008 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex (Post 179307)
Did you read them?

D&C 130:23 states that the Holy Ghost may not tarry with a man.
D&C 121:37 states the the spirit of the Lord can withdraw from a man.

To your meaning, does this not apply to a person who has received the gift of the Holy Ghost?

I don't think it applies to the gift of the Holy Ghost. Notice the sacrament prayer refers to us "having his spirit to be with us ALWAYS." If the HG withdraws from people who have the gift of the HG, why both getting the gift? He can influence you just fine without the gift.

Tex 01-29-2008 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by K-dog (Post 179312)
I don't think it applies to the gift of the Holy Ghost. Notice the sacrament prayer refers to us "having his spirit to be with us ALWAYS." If the HG withdraws from people who have the gift of the HG, why both getting the gift? He can influence you just fine without the gift.

Two things that confuse me about this conclusion:

1. How do arrive at the conclusion that it doesn't apply? Admittedly D&C 130 doesn't specifically say, so you might have a outside point there (though I think it's a stretch). But D&C 121 is talking about those who hold the priesthood ... presumably those who have been confirmed, no?

2. I think you are misunderstanding the sacrament prayers. "That they may always have his Spirit to with them" has several antecedents: conditions, if you will. In other words, "if you do these things, the Spirit will always be with you."

jay santos 01-29-2008 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex (Post 179296)


Amen to the priesthood of everyone on CG. Amen to the priesthood of everyone I've ever met.

K-dog 01-29-2008 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex (Post 179318)
Two things that confuse me about this conclusion:

1. How do arrive at the conclusion that it doesn't apply? Admittedly D&C 130 doesn't specifically say, so you might have a outside point there (though I think it's a stretch). But D&C 121 is talking about those who hold the priesthood ... presumably those who have been confirmed, no?

2. I think you are misunderstanding the sacrament prayers. "That they may always have his Spirit to with them" has several antecedents: conditions, if you will. In other words, "if you do these things, the Spirit will always be with you."

Exactly why just quoting a scripture is problematic. People don't always agree with what a written thing means. What you are saying is that you believe the Gift of the Holy Ghost to be a conditional gift. Are you saying God takes back his gifts? Are you saying the Gift of the HG is no better than not having it?

Tex 01-29-2008 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by K-dog (Post 179321)
Exactly why just quoting a scripture is problematic. People don't always agree with what a written thing means. What you are saying is that you believe the Gift of the Holy Ghost to be a conditional gift. Are you saying God takes back his gifts? Are you saying the Gift of the HG is no better than not having it?

What do you think those two scriptures mean, K-Dog?

K-dog 01-29-2008 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex (Post 179323)
What do you think those two scriptures mean, K-Dog?

I told you. I think it is referring to the influence of the Spirit. I don't think you drive the spirit away but by living incorrectly you no longer hear his influence. I believe sometimes Prophets speak in the way they understand and convey shaded information.

Do you want to respond to my questions? Are they too hard to answer? You seem very interested in no answering questions or defining your own beliefs, as Adam pointed out. If you are so sure you are correct in everything you state, why do you avoid explaining or defining? I admit I'm open to revisiting positions on things. You, otoh, seem to decide what you think and then find facts to support your position.

NorCal Cat 01-30-2008 02:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by K-dog (Post 179321)
Exactly why just quoting a scripture is problematic. People don't always agree with what a written thing means. What you are saying is that you believe the Gift of the Holy Ghost to be a conditional gift. Are you saying God takes back his gifts? Are you saying the Gift of the HG is no better than not having it?

Dude, this is BASIC doctrine. You think once someone is given the Gift of the HG, the HG will ALWAYS be with you, no matter what you do or how you live your life? You can't be serious.

God's not taking back anything. The Gift of the HG means you CAN have his constant presence in your life, IF you live worthily. ONLY those that receive this gift have this opportunity.

scottie 01-30-2008 02:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NorCal Cat (Post 179451)
Dude, this is BASIC doctrine. You think once someone is given the Gift of the HG, the HG will ALWAYS be with you, no matter what you do or how you live your life? You can't be serious.

God's not taking back anything. The Gift of the HG means you CAN have his constant presence in your life, IF you live worthily. ONLY those that receive this gift have this opportunity.

Would NorCal Cat be considered a mullah?

BlueK 01-30-2008 03:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottie (Post 179457)
Would NorCal Cat be considered a mullah?

No, I wouldn't say so.


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