Confess and Forsake

[jay santos]

D&C 58: 43
43 By this ye may know if a man repenteth of his sins—behold, he will aconfess them and bforsake them.


D&C 82: 7. 7 And now, verily I say unto you, I, the Lord, will not lay any asin to your charge; go your ways and sin no more; but unto that soul who sinneth shall the bformer sins return, saith the Lord your God.




Proverbs 28:13
13 He that acovereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso bconfesseth and cforsaketh them shall have mercy.


How do you know if a man forsakes his sins?

A. commits adultery or another "major" sin, repents, does it again a day later, does it again a month later, does it again a year later, does it again 20 years later, never does it again.

B. acts selfishly or another "minor" sin, repents, does it again a day later, does it again a month later, does it again a year later, does it again 20 years later, never does it again.

If I overspend and act gluttonous and I'm confessing to God in my prayers and seeking repentence, am I confessing and repenting for the last 100 times I did the same sin over the past 30 years or is it just for the one sin?

Is God keeping a scorebook on my past, repented for sins? Do all my former sins return, as Tex interprets the scripture?

I find the standard interpetations of these scriptures completely worthless and illogical. That's not to say I don't believe these scriptures are true; I just interpret them differently (in a way which Tex believes minimizes the need for the atonement--what??).

[BlueHair]

Originally Posted by jay santos

D&C 58: 43
43 By this ye may know if a man repenteth of his sins—behold, he will aconfess them and bforsake them.


D&C 82: 7. 7 And now, verily I say unto you, I, the Lord, will not lay any asin to your charge; go your ways and sin no more; but unto that soul who sinneth shall the bformer sins return, saith the Lord your God.




Proverbs 28:13
13 He that acovereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso bconfesseth and cforsaketh them shall have mercy.


How do you know if a man forsakes his sins?

A. commits adultery or another "major" sin, repents, does it again a day later, does it again a month later, does it again a year later, does it again 20 years later, never does it again.

B. acts selfishly or another "minor" sin, repents, does it again a day later, does it again a month later, does it again a year later, does it again 20 years later, never does it again.

If I overspend and act gluttonous and I'm confessing to God in my prayers and seeking repentence, am I confessing and repenting for the last 100 times I did the same sin over the past 30 years or is it just for the one sin?

Is God keeping a scorebook on my past, repented for sins? Do all my former sins return, as Tex interprets the scripture?

I find the standard interpetations of these scriptures completely worthless and illogical. That's not to say I don't believe these scriptures are true; I just interpret them differently (in a way which Tex believes minimizes the need for the atonement--what??).

This illustrates the value of deathbed repentance. Repent and die before you are able to sin again.

[ERCougar]

My unsolicited opinion:
The step-by-step process of repentance that we teach on our mission and that we are taught in YM/YW is a ridiculous oversimplification, and one that's really not even helpful. The best definition I have seen is the one in the Bible Dictionary: "The Greek word of which this is the translation denotes a change of mind, i.e., a fresh view about God, about oneself, and about the world." This is the only thing that makes sense about the forsaking aspect of things. When we repeat sin, we slip back into the old mindset/decision rule/paradigm, and thus all the old sins return as if we weren't redeemed. We then repent again and, with the help of the Atonement, adopt the fresh mindset again. It's not really a step-by-step process (and hardly something that anyone else, i.e. a church court, can judge).

[creekster]

Originally Posted by ERCougar

My unsolicited opinion:
The step-by-step process of repentance that we teach on our mission and that we are taught in YM/YW is a ridiculous oversimplification, and one that's really not even helpful. The best definition I have seen is the one in the Bible Dictionary: "The Greek word of which this is the translation denotes a change of mind, i.e., a fresh view about God, about oneself, and about the world." This is the only thing that makes sense about the forsaking aspect of things. When we repeat sin, we slip back into the old mindset/decision rule/paradigm, and thus all the old sins return as if we weren't redeemed. We then repent again and, with the help of the Atonement, adopt the fresh mindset again. It's not really a step-by-step process (and hardly something that anyone else, i.e. a church court, can judge).

When I was on my mission some wild radical group gave me a tract urging a vilent overthrow of the governemtn and used this defintion of repent (repentez-vous in French) to justify it. They argued Jesus was nto saying to stop sinning, but he was saying you needed ot have a complete change of world view, and thus demanded a revolution.

[RockyBalboa]

Originally Posted by jay santos

D&C 58: 43
43 By this ye may know if a man repenteth of his sins—behold, he will aconfess them and bforsake them.


D&C 82: 7. 7 And now, verily I say unto you, I, the Lord, will not lay any asin to your charge; go your ways and sin no more; but unto that soul who sinneth shall the bformer sins return, saith the Lord your God.




Proverbs 28:13
13 He that acovereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso bconfesseth and cforsaketh them shall have mercy.


How do you know if a man forsakes his sins?

A. commits adultery or another "major" sin, repents, does it again a day later, does it again a month later, does it again a year later, does it again 20 years later, never does it again.

B. acts selfishly or another "minor" sin, repents, does it again a day later, does it again a month later, does it again a year later, does it again 20 years later, never does it again.

If I overspend and act gluttonous and I'm confessing to God in my prayers and seeking repentence, am I confessing and repenting for the last 100 times I did the same sin over the past 30 years or is it just for the one sin?

Is God keeping a scorebook on my past, repented for sins? Do all my former sins return, as Tex interprets the scripture?

I find the standard interpetations of these scriptures completely worthless and illogical. That's not to say I don't believe these scriptures are true; I just interpret them differently (in a way which Tex believes minimizes the need for the atonement--what??).

You need to tell the truth about why you're so obsessed and bitter about this topic at the same time.

Then people will understand you and your self loathing better.

[jay santos]

Originally Posted by ERCougar

My unsolicited opinion:
The step-by-step process of repentance that we teach on our mission and that we are taught in YM/YW is a ridiculous oversimplification, and one that's really not even helpful. The best definition I have seen is the one in the Bible Dictionary: "The Greek word of which this is the translation denotes a change of mind, i.e., a fresh view about God, about oneself, and about the world." This is the only thing that makes sense about the forsaking aspect of things. When we repeat sin, we slip back into the old mindset/decision rule/paradigm, and thus all the old sins return as if we weren't redeemed. We then repent again and, with the help of the Atonement, adopt the fresh mindset again. It's not really a step-by-step process (and hardly something that anyone else, i.e. a church court, can judge).

That's close to my best interpretation of that scripture. My interpretation would be it is describing not a regular day to day (even serious) sin, but a change in mindset like you say, of one who is in the covenant of Christ to one who has deliberately left the covenant of Christ. i.e. I commit sin, but I have no faith in Christ, intention to repent, or desire to stay in the covenant of Christ. Therefore my former state of not being redeemed as returned. Of course Tex will pick this apart. Go ahead. He won't state what he believes, he'll just pick apart.

[scottie]

Originally Posted by jay santos

... Of course Tex will pick this apart. Go ahead. He won't state what he believes, he'll just pick apart.

Now that right there is funny (and spot-on).