Bishop shopping - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

Hazzard · 12-17-2005, 06:49 AM

As a veteran single adult, I have seen my share of singles wards. As such, I have also seen my share of bishops (some more than others, of course :wink

.

On one end of the "Judge in Israel" spectrum, I have known bishops who believe that, short of fornication and/or oral sex, you should go your way and sin no more. In other words, short of those sins, you keep your temple recommend and get nothing more than a slap on the wrist.

On the other end of the spectrum, I have known bishops who believe that anything more than a short kiss is grounds for taking away temple privileges for a time. For example, one of my friends' Stake President's was about to initiate a church court for a one-time transgression for which most bishops would give nothing more than a slap on the wrist. Fortunately, some higher-ups got wind of it and reminded the SP that he was a judge first and prosecutor second.

In many of the areas where LDS singles congregate, there are several singles wards from which to choose. Why on earth, then, would any sane human confess a sin to a hard-liner bishop (Eyes of Texas, that's you I'm talking about!) when a more forgiving singles ward bishop is available? Am I off for suggesting that bishop shopping might be a good idea -- in fact, the only logical idea -- in such a case?

But that's not even the main issue. The larger issue, of course, is why there isn't a standard way of dealing with certain standard sins. I'm sure there are good reasons why it isn't spelled out for bishops, but I think it's kind of strange not that bishops can have such varying views on the proper consequences for certain sins, but that they are allowed to execute their views to such varying degrees.

ute4ever · 12-17-2005, 09:23 AM

I too have experienced this. The most striking example was when I was engaged, and my singles ward bishop was very liberal. He basically said to look forward to the honeymoon but not to do anything that would keep us from getting hitched in the temple. How subjective.

Her bishop on the other hand, was so concerned with the idea of kissing while lying on the couch that he recommended postponing the big day.

Hazzard · 12-17-2005, 04:53 PM

That's a perfect example of what I'm talking about. I hope your response to her bishop was that he's not your bishop so he has no authority over you whatsoever. Not only are the strict ones strict, but they usually also have personalities which cause them to want to impose their hard-line views on everyone else.

I was DATING a girl whose bishop wanted to talk to me. This guy was a nerdy CES director (not that they're all nerdy, just the he happened to be) -- the kind who probably still wishes the Law of Moses were in effect. Uh ... no thanks! I'll stick to talking to my own bishop, gracias.

VAX77 · 12-17-2005, 07:50 PM

I am just gald I do not have to be a bishop. Imagine what they go through. I do have to say, it does depend on the individual sinning. Some are extremely repentent and are ready to move on on their own. Others need a little( or a lot) of punishment, depending on their own dispositions. They may be going in to the bishop out of habit for mistakes instead of change of heart. Some people need someone to confess to help themselves move on, etc.

I am glad that there are no guidelines for every sin imagineable. That being said, there will be human error involved with this process because human judgement(with the hopes of spiritual guidance) is involved. Also, do not forget that people interperet different situations differently, even spiritual ones.

I have the same views with the Patriot act and cameras(1984 like tactics) all around because I would rather be blown up and have a private life, than be safe and have no privacy what so ever. Thats my two cents.

I feel your pain(or other's peoples) though. I have one through similar experiences. I have got to a point where I just say screw it and follow the Lord as best I can and hope that I continue to get better when it comes to being a disciple. No bishop or sp can take that away from me, as long as I am being sincere in my devotion and not looking to get away with something....

SoCalCoug · 12-18-2005, 01:52 AM

Quote:

I have the same views with the Patriot act and cameras(1984 like tactics) all around because I would rather be blown up and have a private life, than be safe and have no privacy what so ever.

I'm with you there. The sad thing is, there are many, especially over on Cougarboard, who feel the opposite. And they think we're communists for thinking otherwise. Which is kind of ironic, isn't it?

mpfunk · 12-18-2005, 02:56 AM

Sadly I have no need to do Bishop shopping for the reasons that you stated, lousy lack of females wanting to speak to me.

I did find it particularly funny the other day when someone I knew from the ward who is getting married in a week stated he could not come hang out with us. When pressed for the reason why he stated that he was going to be too busy as he put it "pushing the limits of appropriate physical contact" with his fiance.

VAX77 · 12-18-2005, 05:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoCalCoug

Quote:

I have the same views with the Patriot act and cameras(1984 like tactics) all around because I would rather be blown up and have a private life, than be safe and have no privacy what so ever.

I'm with you there. The sad thing is, there are many, especially over on Cougarboard, who feel the opposite. And they think we're communists for thinking otherwise. Which is kind of ironic, isn't it?

It is sad that so many would think the opposite. I wonder what Brother Joseph would say..... I have my feelings what he would say.

It is funny that the Church used to be on the other side of the tracks when it came to the government and now we(i say that loosely) are blind followers of the republican party. I tend to lean repub, but I think every issue through, kind of my "line item veto" abilty on any party platform.

12-17-2005, 06:49 AM	#1
Hazzard Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 158	Bishop shopping As a veteran single adult, I have seen my share of singles wards. As such, I have also seen my share of bishops (some more than others, of course :wink. On one end of the "Judge in Israel" spectrum, I have known bishops who believe that, short of fornication and/or oral sex, you should go your way and sin no more. In other words, short of those sins, you keep your temple recommend and get nothing more than a slap on the wrist. On the other end of the spectrum, I have known bishops who believe that anything more than a short kiss is grounds for taking away temple privileges for a time. For example, one of my friends' Stake President's was about to initiate a church court for a one-time transgression for which most bishops would give nothing more than a slap on the wrist. Fortunately, some higher-ups got wind of it and reminded the SP that he was a judge first and prosecutor second. In many of the areas where LDS singles congregate, there are several singles wards from which to choose. Why on earth, then, would any sane human confess a sin to a hard-liner bishop (Eyes of Texas, that's you I'm talking about!) when a more forgiving singles ward bishop is available? Am I off for suggesting that bishop shopping might be a good idea -- in fact, the only logical idea -- in such a case? But that's not even the main issue. The larger issue, of course, is why there isn't a standard way of dealing with certain standard sins. I'm sure there are good reasons why it isn't spelled out for bishops, but I think it's kind of strange not that bishops can have such varying views on the proper consequences for certain sins, but that they are allowed to execute their views to such varying degrees.

12-17-2005, 09:23 AM	#2
ute4ever I must not tell lies Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 5,103	I too have experienced this. The most striking example was when I was engaged, and my singles ward bishop was very liberal. He basically said to look forward to the honeymoon but not to do anything that would keep us from getting hitched in the temple. How subjective. Her bishop on the other hand, was so concerned with the idea of kissing while lying on the couch that he recommended postponing the big day.

12-17-2005, 04:53 PM	#3
Hazzard Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 158	That's a perfect example of what I'm talking about. I hope your response to her bishop was that he's not your bishop so he has no authority over you whatsoever. Not only are the strict ones strict, but they usually also have personalities which cause them to want to impose their hard-line views on everyone else. I was DATING a girl whose bishop wanted to talk to me. This guy was a nerdy CES director (not that they're all nerdy, just the he happened to be) -- the kind who probably still wishes the Law of Moses were in effect. Uh ... no thanks! I'll stick to talking to my own bishop, gracias.

12-17-2005, 07:50 PM	#4
VAX77 Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Chicago Posts: 106	I am just gald I do not have to be a bishop. Imagine what they go through. I do have to say, it does depend on the individual sinning. Some are extremely repentent and are ready to move on on their own. Others need a little( or a lot) of punishment, depending on their own dispositions. They may be going in to the bishop out of habit for mistakes instead of change of heart. Some people need someone to confess to help themselves move on, etc. I am glad that there are no guidelines for every sin imagineable. That being said, there will be human error involved with this process because human judgement(with the hopes of spiritual guidance) is involved. Also, do not forget that people interperet different situations differently, even spiritual ones. I have the same views with the Patriot act and cameras(1984 like tactics) all around because I would rather be blown up and have a private life, than be safe and have no privacy what so ever. Thats my two cents. I feel your pain(or other's peoples) though. I have one through similar experiences. I have got to a point where I just say screw it and follow the Lord as best I can and hope that I continue to get better when it comes to being a disciple. No bishop or sp can take that away from me, as long as I am being sincere in my devotion and not looking to get away with something....

12-18-2005, 02:56 AM	#6
mpfunk Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 2,619	Sadly I have no need to do Bishop shopping for the reasons that you stated, lousy lack of females wanting to speak to me. I did find it particularly funny the other day when someone I knew from the ward who is getting married in a week stated he could not come hang out with us. When pressed for the reason why he stated that he was going to be too busy as he put it "pushing the limits of appropriate physical contact" with his fiance.