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02-23-2008, 10:53 PM | #1 |
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Location: Happy Valley, PA
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More fallout from gay marriage spat
I know this is only one side of the story, but it still seems a little bit like a witch hunt. It's interesting how arbitrary the crackdowns seem to be.
http://www.sltrib.com/ci_8345693
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02-23-2008, 11:19 PM | #2 |
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Location: Orange County, CA
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There is a scene in the movie "Witness," where Kelly McGillis's character, Rachel, is having a heated discussion with her dad, Eli. Her father warns her that many in their congregation have been gossiping about her interactions with Harrison Ford's character....that she looks at him, laughs, smiles, whatever.
Eli warns her that the leadership council is thinking of shunning her. Eli expains that he would not be able to pray with her, eat at the same table, talk to her, or even so much as take something from her hand. It is at this point of the movie where Rachel seems to realize that all of these consequences make no sense and are in place simply for the age old reason....."just because." This article about disciplining LDS members in good standing because they are not opposed to gay marriage reminds me of the aforementioned scene from Witness. I am not sure what is accomplished by excommunicating members who write letters of concern to a newspaper. Why do we do this? Just because? If no unhallowed hand will stop the work from progressing, then who cares what is written? For a Church that doesnt concern itself with the ways of the world, it seems to be a bit over-sensitive about a few local yokels writing letters. Such tactics certainly have a "chilling effect" on exploring one's own spirituality if some concerns or worries about the Gospel or Church governance are met with the threat of discipline. In the spirit of honest and full disclosure, a few scenes after Rachel tells Eli to not worry about all the gossip, she lathers up and attacks Harrison Ford with her moistened sweater cannons, which, to my knowledge, is an anomoly in the world of traditional Amish courtship rituals. So I guess there is also something to be said about ecclesiastical "prevent defense."
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02-23-2008, 11:35 PM | #3 | |
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02-23-2008, 11:37 PM | #4 |
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They look like troublemakers to me: Peter has a beard.
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02-23-2008, 11:45 PM | #5 |
Charon
Join Date: Jan 2006
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What a sad story.
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"... the arc of the universe is long but it bends toward justice." Martin Luther King, Jr. |
02-24-2008, 12:03 AM | #6 |
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Posts: 5,084
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Perhaps this is what Elder Oaks meant by you don't go against the leaders even if they are wrong.
From a purely organizational viewpoint this is what you have to do to keep the troops in line. What if members started actively opposing the churches recent stance on illegal immigrants. In the privacy of your own thoughts I don't think the church cares what you think. It is OK as long as what you do won't lead to harm of the structure or organization. We are allowed to have our freedom on many many issues. However, if the church takes a stand, it isn't a democracy. You fall into line, at least publicly. You have to decide what is most important. Full association or another path. |
02-24-2008, 12:10 AM | #7 | |
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Quote:
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Fitter. Happier. More Productive. "Everyone is against me. Everyone is fawning for 3D's attention and defending him." -- SeattleUte |
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02-24-2008, 12:34 AM | #8 |
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It's odd if it's occurring that way.
However, these guys could do it differently by just stating, "hey, we oppose the FMA or whatever it's called." The mistake, politically, these folk make, is to go public against the Church. In many other circumstances folks can do that and get away with it, but not in this context. Nonetheless, I imagine this too shall pass and change.
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02-24-2008, 12:35 AM | #9 | |
Demiurge
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02-24-2008, 12:40 AM | #10 |
Demiurge
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 36,365
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I guess what it boils down to, is that I believe in a personal relationship with God. And I don't think ANY mortal man has the power to step between a person and God.
I don't care what the religion is, I don't care about what priesthood, what authority, or anything. The personal relationship between a person and God is inviolate, and only dependent on God and that person. I recognize that social organizations do have and should have the power to regulate their membership. That's fine. And we are always taking in data that either pushes into stronger or weaker membership in that social organization. We need to decide who we want to be. Figure out how big this tent is. And also we need to think about why some stakes have larger tents and other stakes have smaller tents. Maybe SEIQ is right. Maybe the very soul of the LDS church is up for grabs right now, and the mullahs are in furious attacking retreat. It's sad. |
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