06-27-2008, 09:13 PM | #41 | |
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Quote:
So were the prophets lying when they said we judged by what was written down or should they have you also will be judged by the unwritten rules?
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Its all about the suit |
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06-27-2008, 09:15 PM | #42 | |
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Quote:
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06-27-2008, 09:16 PM | #43 | ||
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Quote:
Quote:
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"Have we been commanded not to call a prophet an insular racist? Link?" "And yes, [2010] is a very good year to be a Democrat. Perhaps the best year in decades ..." - Cali Coug "Oh dear, granny, what a long tail our puss has got." - Brigham Young |
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06-27-2008, 09:20 PM | #44 | |
Charon
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Quote:
http://content.lib.utah.edu/cdm4/doc...&CISOSHOW=6510
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"... the arc of the universe is long but it bends toward justice." Martin Luther King, Jr. |
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06-27-2008, 09:21 PM | #45 |
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Me and the big guy will discuss things over a glass of wine (like the scriptures say). I doubt he is a hypocrite.
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06-27-2008, 09:21 PM | #46 |
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06-28-2008, 01:24 AM | #47 | |
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I'm glad we're now fighting about whether or not we'll be drinking wine at the judgment bar...
ANYWAY...regardless of what the scriptures say, my heart (and brain) agree with Solon: Quote:
I can understand its role in a limited number of cases in which the church's reputation or the well-being of other members or units is threatened. I'm not sure I would put a case of adultery in that list. |
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06-28-2008, 04:39 AM | #48 |
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If someone goes before the bishop and stops or stops on their own aren't they in the same place?
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"I always rode to my limit. If I won by three minutes, that's because I couldn't make four." Eddy Merckx |
06-28-2008, 04:34 PM | #49 |
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06-29-2008, 12:50 AM | #50 | |
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Why Disciplinary Councils.
Quote:
I am coming in late to this discusssion and I apologize if some have already shared but...here is my perspective having served as a bishop for a little over six years...I had little experience (served as branch president when I was a missionary) when the calling was extended and I accepted....I was only 32 and knew nothing about church discipline, counseling others, and what to do after confessions...I still remember the first Sunday, ward members were lining up to speak with me to seek counsel and some to unload heavy burdens they had been carrying around for years. The outgoing Bishop handed me the keys to the building, shook my hand and smiled at me as he walked out with his family...it was trial by fire. However, the experiences I shared with ward members made me a better person and for many ward members the shared experiences changed their lives. My understanding of purpose of Church discipline is that it is three fold: 1) save the soul of the transgressor, 2) protect the innocent, 3) safeguard the purity, integrity, and good name of the Church. In D&C 58 it states: 14 Yea, for this cause I have sent you hither, and have selected my servant Edward Partridge, and have appointed unto him his mission in this land. 15 But if he repent not of his sins, which are aunbelief and blindness of heart, let him take heed lest he fall. 16 Behold his mission is given unto him, and it shall not be given again. 17 And whoso standeth in this mission is appointed to be a judge in Israel, like as it was in ancient days, to divide the lands of the heritage of God unto his children; 18 And to judge his people by the testimony of the just, and by the assistance of his counselors, according to the laws of the kingdom which are given by the prophets of God. 19 For verily I say unto you, my law shall be kept on this land. From the above I understand that the bishop is responsible for both the temporal and spiritual needs of his ward. For most of us, it will be a rare ocassion when we will need to seek the bishop's help. But for many, the bishop is a source of counsel when facing burdens. I don't ever recall deciding that it was in the best interest of the individual who truly repented to be ex-communicated. Most of the decisions made by the formal disciplinary councils that I participated in were of the "no action", "probation (with restrictions), and disfellowshipped type. The tone of the council was set by the attitude of the individual, truly humbled/repentant vs. a boastful attitude about the transgression. Another key factor was who the individual was, ie, priesthood holder, previous positions of responsibility, returned missionary, etc.. vs. a teenager attempting to find his way in life or a young adult making some bad choices. The majority of the councils I participated in were informal, just the ward member and I. Most of these type were initiated by the ward member who would come to confess a transgression. Some I had to initiate because that individual participated in a transgression with one who previously came in to confesss or I leard about a transgression in some other way. I always emphasized that it was not me that would forgive the transgression and pointed them to seek Heavenly Father's forgiveness. I was simply the individual that they needed to share the transgression with and then if they needed further counsel, they were welcome to come back any time to discuss. We set goals on taking steps to overcome the transgression and subsequent visits were for me to find out how they were doing, to answer questions, be a sounding board, and to be a support if they continued to struggle. It was a wonderful experience to see someone truly repent, change their lives, go on a mission, go to the temple, etc... To ER Cougar, encourage your sister to go see her bishop, despite previous experiences with church leaders. Taking that step can truly be a turning point in her life. Not knowing the circumstances of the transgressions, I do not know if the Bishop will determine if a formal disciplinary council will be needed, but if one is held, so be it...it could be a spiritual experience for all involved, in particular for your sister. The three men that will participate will have to rely on inspiration and guidance of the Spirit of the Lord and if they do, the right decision will be made. I was released from my calling almost 10 years ago...it was a sad day when it happened...I knew that I would no longer be able to be of service in the capacity of the calling with people like ER Cougar's sister who are struggling in life and are looking for happiness..the happiness that can only come with our acceptance of Christ as our Savior. That is my two cents and apologize for my rambling. -Cougarobgon |
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