02-03-2009, 03:56 PM | #101 | ||||
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"Have we been commanded not to call a prophet an insular racist? Link?" "And yes, [2010] is a very good year to be a Democrat. Perhaps the best year in decades ..." - Cali Coug "Oh dear, granny, what a long tail our puss has got." - Brigham Young |
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02-03-2009, 04:14 PM | #102 | |
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I believe there are many hard-to-understand doctrines/events in scripture and church history whose full purpose and meaning can only be discovered by revelation. You're welcome to disagree with that hypothesis--I won't accuse you of whopping, self-serving, intellectual dishonesty--but I think there's solid support for it in scripture. The priesthood ban is just one of these. You can be the most brilliant man to ever walk the earth, with all the learning and research tools that the 21st century has to offer, and still not discover the purposes of God. Remember, the ban was rescinded by revelation. It wasn't a bunch of scholars who got together and persuaded Kimball and Co. that it needed to be removed. Instead, it came by pleading and petition of many prophets throughout several decades (assuming the DOM book is to be believed). If you think you can figure it out, more power to you. If somehow that puts your mind at ease and makes your testimony easier to bear, more power to you. I think it's a misplaced notion. But I won't actually say so until I start hearing folks saying they think the church ought to accommodate that misplaced notion, to the extent of getting quite nasty.
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"Have we been commanded not to call a prophet an insular racist? Link?" "And yes, [2010] is a very good year to be a Democrat. Perhaps the best year in decades ..." - Cali Coug "Oh dear, granny, what a long tail our puss has got." - Brigham Young Last edited by Tex; 02-03-2009 at 04:26 PM. |
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02-03-2009, 04:20 PM | #103 | |
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Tex please reconcile:
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And then you elevate your ability to reason above scholarship. And revelation above that.
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Ἓν οἶδα ὅτι οὐδὲν οἶδα |
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02-03-2009, 08:56 PM | #104 | |
Charon
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"Say what you will about national socialism, dude. At least it's an ethos."
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"... the arc of the universe is long but it bends toward justice." Martin Luther King, Jr. |
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02-03-2009, 09:11 PM | #105 |
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Hugh B. Brown taught that revelation could come through scholarship.
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"Do not despise the words of prophets, but test everything; hold fast to what is good; " 1 Thess. 5:21 (NRSV) We all trust our own unorthodoxies. |
02-03-2009, 09:12 PM | #106 | ||
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Such research would lead you to discover that the church came very close recently to issuing a formal apology. You may also discover that top church leaders are much less likely (if ever) to say ("God must have had his reasons"). Now we are getting quotes like this: Quote:
Notice the conspicuous absence of "We don't know why God did it". And yet Tex sits around waiting for a revelation from God that would overturn the folklore.
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"... the arc of the universe is long but it bends toward justice." Martin Luther King, Jr. Last edited by Jeff Lebowski; 02-03-2009 at 09:14 PM. |
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02-03-2009, 10:05 PM | #107 | |
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But I don't want to wade too far back into the blacks/priesthood tall grass. We've been over this territory a thousand times already and it's redundant. If we could return to the original topic ... I'd rather to stick with the ban as just an example of broader concept: that understanding the whereto's and the whyfor's is unnecessary for a strong testimony. Or further, that spending disproportionate focus on those things (in the noble name of "inoculation") can actually weaken faith. Your thesis here, if I understand it correctly (I'm trying to be fair here), is that more scholarship, more information, more research can only be a good thing. Beyond that, you believe it is inevitable anyway, due to the speedy methods of disseminating knowledge these days. Thus, the church should not only accommodate, but facilitate. My point is and has always been that such is fine for those who want it. But in the grand scheme of faith and testimony, it plays a near insignificant role (or ought to). A man's spiritual progression simply should not have any foundation on the details behind the priesthood ban, or any other controversial problem in scripture or church history. And I don't blame the church, nor do I think others should, for putting (relatively) minimal effort in facilitating it.
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"Have we been commanded not to call a prophet an insular racist? Link?" "And yes, [2010] is a very good year to be a Democrat. Perhaps the best year in decades ..." - Cali Coug "Oh dear, granny, what a long tail our puss has got." - Brigham Young |
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02-03-2009, 10:43 PM | #108 | |
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Get your stinking paws off me, you damned, dirty Yewt! "Now perhaps as I spanked myself screaming out "Kozlowski, say it like you mean it bitch!" might have been out of line, but such was the mood." - Goatnapper "If you want to fatten a pig up to make the pig MORE delicious, you can feed it almost anything. Seriously. The pig is like the car on Back to the Future. You put in garbage, and out comes something magical!" - Cali Coug |
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