CG question I least understand

[SeattleUte]

didn't an apostle recently give a speech saying something like henceforth the LDS Church must be a tighter ship, less tolerant, maybe a smaller tent? Packer? I know I'm not making that up.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Originally Posted by RockyBalboa

What statements?

Statements like this:

"Honestly, I don't know why any of you people are still in the church."

FWIW, I am not offended by your invitations to "tell me why you believe". It has to do with the tone of the question.

[jay santos]

Originally Posted by Tex

I don't know if this directed at me or not, since I recently posted to that effect.

Of course Mike Waters, among others, immediately and ungraciously assumed the hidden subtext is that I want everyone out but me and my ilk. Not true.

I have a hard time understanding some of the fierce and, truthfully, quite vicious attacks on an organization (and its leadership) from people who believe that same organization provides them the saving ordinances and doctrines.

I am forced to assume, as I said in my post, that they remain members because of a testimony, however deeply buried. But I asked the question rhetorically because the behavior seems out of place with the belief. Ie, it confuses me.

That was my sole motivation. If you find it unhelpful, I'm sorry. Ignore me, or ignore the post. Otherwise, I'm interested in hearing the answers.

Tex what exactly is you and your ilk? Aren't you divorced? And you talk about your church service as it is in the past. Do you find it ironic you're calling to repentance mostly men who are active, TR carrying, married, raising children, involved in church leadership in the present?

[smokymountainrain]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski

I find statements like that extremely offensive.

[RockyBalboa]

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

I am not pointing a finger at anyone in general. I just wonder what it is in the Mormon psyche that so commonly leads to that statement.

Mormons can be an odd bunch at times. There seems to be an element of hoping that others fail in the church.

I have thought about this issue a lot, and it is perhaps what frustrates me the most out of many of the "mullahs" in the church.

The first I remember noticing the phenomenon was in church as a young adult when the teacher asked what percentage of people we thought would be exhaulted to live with God after this life. Most answers ranged from 5%-25%. The teacher then quoted a GA (can't even remember who) who said that over 95% would be exhaulted to live with God. The class overall seemed quite disappointed with that response, several noting it wouldn't be "fair" because they were working so much harder to do what was right than most other people in the world (paraphrasing there).

Perhaps it is a function of the LDS focus on works rather than grace. The church clearly believes heavily in grace, but that aspect of salvation is somewhat lost in translation with a disproportionate amount of attention paid to works.

Anyway, this is a bit rambling, but I have wondered from time to time if that doesn't play a role in people getting mad and saying "why are you even in this church!"

Cail you could take that situation and apply it to any facet of life though. I know you're using the church as the backdrop for your point and that's fine, but there are times where someone is going on and on and railing against certain churches, jobs, families, teams, etc..e.tc...etc.....and in fact I think it's very normal for the person who's constantly listening to someone bitch and moan to think....."Well hell if this person is so damn unhappy, then why do they work here? Why they do go to church here? Why do they go to family activities? Why do they stay in this relationship? Why do they cheer for that team?"

I mean really that could be applied in a lot more contexts than just shown.

Sure it might not be "helpful", but it's normal and makes sense for someone to ask and/or wonder that.

[Indy Coug]

What can be confusing is when the language, tone and rhetoric used by people who claim to still be true believers is virtually indistinguishable from those self-professed non-believers or former belivers on this site.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by jay santos

Tex what exactly is you and your ilk? Aren't you divorced? And you talk about your church service as it is in the past. Do you find it ironic you're calling to repentance mostly men who are active, TR carrying, married, raising children, involved in church leadership in the present?

The word "ilk" was basically a sarcastic rhetorical device meant to elicit a chuckle. Don't take it too seriously.

I have said nothing about the personal details of my life, including age, marital status, children or (I think) even previous callings. For various reasons. So I'm not sure how you think you know anything about me in that regard.

Try to evaluate my posts on their merits rather than trying (and failing) to figure out if I'm a hypocrit, ala Lebowski.

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

didn't an apostle recently give a speech saying something like heretofore the LDS Church must be a tighter ship, less tolerant, maybe a smaller tent? Packer? I know I'm not making that up.

You would never do that. Of course, given your up to date familiarity with the Church, that could have been Brigham Young who gave that opinion.

[SoonerCoug]

Originally Posted by Tex

I have said nothing about the personal details of my life, including age, marital status, children or (I think) even previous callings. For various reasons.

I know why Tex never mentions his personal life.

I think Tex is a computer program operating out of the Church Office Building as part of top secret enterprise called "Project A-hole: infiltration of progressive LDS message boards."

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

I know why Tex never mentions his personal life.

I think Tex is a computer program operating out of the Church Office Building as part of top secret enterprise called "Project A-hole: infiltration of progressive LDS message boards."

Actually he works at the University of Oklahoma in the medical IT department.