Fawn Brodie...

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by Archaea

You're no better than an apologist and wouldn't make a very good historian.


As soon as information appears that doesn't fit within your world view, you dismiss it out of hand.

BTW, I don't entirely trust Wikipedia, but I don't find it odd for a dying person to have somebody pray for them. Even the cynic may think, "hey, if it's not true and I die, no harm done, but if there is some truth, then it might help." I'd say that might be somebody covering her bases. Dying people, even hard core cynics act differently during the moment of death, not that they are any closer to perceiving truth but they change, at least the few deaths I have witnessed.

So it is possible, it was fabricated or it is also plausibly true. Either her corpse has decomposed and nothing further awaits Brodie, or she waits in Dante's infernal at the lowest level of purgatory.

I just said the story is suspect. It jus is. I want to know details, who was there, who repeated the story, who wrote the article, who he talked to, etc.

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

The whole story about the priesthood blessing is suspect.

Unlike the assertions of selective evidence and broad-based wild conjecture in her biography?

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

So Seattle, do you think that Joseph Smith wrote the Book of Mormon, in a fashion not inspired by extra-terrestrial beings/forces?

The Book of Mormon is by far the most important product of J.S. It stands here today as a document that defies simple explanation. And pardon me if I get a bit religious here, which I know is uncool--it is the vehicle that allows for the revelation of God to Man of the restoration of His church (for those of us who believe such a process exists).

These types of assertions are why it's worthwhile to examine the literary/artistic merit of the Book of Mormon, and the originality of its concepts.

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

I just said the story is suspect. It jus is. I want to know details, who was there, who repeated the story, who wrote the article, who he talked to, etc.

why is it a big deal to you? Woman wanted a blessing. Didnt' want to be baptized. Didn't apologize. Didn't express regret.

She wanted a freaking blessing.

Is there some conspiracy that is trying to discredit her by saying that she wanted and received a prayer as she was dying?

Maybe Fusnik is right. She was move ambivalent than she allowed others to see .

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

These types of assertions are why it's worthwhile to examine the literary/artistic merit of the Book of Mormon, and the originality of its concepts.

Yes, this is an end in and of itself to people who don't believe in faith or the power of the Holy Ghost.

And that is the divide.

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

why is it a big deal to you?

Maybe Fusnik is right. She was move ambivalent than she allowed others to see .

Somebody thought it worthwhile to put it into the article.

You answered your own question as to why whoever wrote the article thought it was a big enough deal to put in.

[fusnik11]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

Somebody thought it worthwhile to put it into the article.

You answered your own question as to why whoever wrote the article thought it was a big enough deal to put in.

Seattle, would it lessen your opinion of the book if she suffered emotionally through her whole life concerning the writings of her book?

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

Somebody thought it worthwhile to put it into the article.

You answered your own question as to why whoever wrote the article thought it was a big enough deal to put in.

Seemed the purpose was to dispute that she had requested re-baptism.

And btw, wikipedia articles are rarely written by just one person.

what we know from you:

1. you misread it saying that the article did not say she requested it
2. that you choose not to believe it
3. you think if she had asked it, it would be an important reflection of her beliefs

I think this says more about you than it does about Brodie.

I think it is much more believable, based on the fact that she was a human being, that she was a complex person who waxed and waned as to her views on Mormonism and the supernatural. Or course her "waxing" may not have been particularly impressive, at least from the outside, to the typical Mormon observer.

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by fusnik11

Seattle, would it lessen your opinion of the book if she suffered emotionally through her whole life concerning the writings of her book?

I don't know what that is supposed to mean nor your source for the statement. We are all emotionally wounded, as Waters will confirm. That was part of our parents' job, to wound us emotionally. Apostasy often is an emotionally wrenching experience becuase it costs the Mormon-raised apostate (inevitably) most if not all of the friends of his youth and even often the genuine love of his family. I understand there's a book on this called "Suddenly Strangers." It's one of the Church's primary instruments of coersion. So, yes, I'm sure that emotionally her apostasy was not a walk in the park.

[fusnik11]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

I don't know what that is supposed to mean nor your source for the statement. We are all emotionally wounded, as Waters will confirm. That was part of our parents' job, to wound us emotionally. Apostasy often is an emotionally wrenching experience becuase it costs the Mormon-raised apostate (inevitably) most if not all of the friends of his youth and even often the genuine love of his family. I understand there's a book on this called "Suddenly Strangers." It's one of the Church's primary instruments of coersion. So, yes, I'm sure that emotionally her apostasy was not a walk in the park.

My source is me.

And her apostacy wasn't wrenching to her because of her youth, nor her familial ties, she struggled with her personal feelings, and the material she presented in her book. She fought with her reconciliation of her faith and her reason.

The author she presents herself in her book, is not the same person who she was privately. I believe the accounts of her blessing, I also believe that she wanted rebaptism at a later life. I know that publically she stated differently, but privately I believe her to have felt contrary than her public persona allowed.