California....Vanguard of Civil Rights

[TripletDaddy]

Originally Posted by ERCougar

Out of curiosity, what does your wife think about it? My wife disagrees with me on this one. She's generally more conservative anyway, so it's not a huge shock, but she feels that letting gay people marry does negatively affect traditional marriage. I think she (and maybe other women...hence my question) views marriage differently, although I'm not sure I can explain how.

I'm with you though--I think it's very akin to other legal activities that we don't participate in, and I think it's beneficial for all involved when the government stays out of legislating morality (to the extent that it's possible).

My wife wasnt really for it or against it when we were first married. In fact, both of us kind of toed the company line, so to speak.

Then one of my best friends came out of the closet....around 2002. She was also affected by that because he was a close friend of ours. We have all stayed close and fortunately, our relationship is even better now (although not without some challenges).

Since that happened, we are both of the same mind on this issue. I dont judge your wife and I am sure she is a wonderful loving person. But I am grateful that my wife and I are on the same page because this can be a very polarizing issue.

If gays start getting married today, I just dont get how it changes anything my wife and I are doing in our home....what we teach our kids, how we interact with others, our dedication to each other, etc..my wife has expressed a similar sentiment.

[landpoke]

Originally Posted by TripletDaddy

If gays start getting married today, I just dont get how it changes anything my wife and I are doing in our home....what we teach our kids, how we interact with others, our dedication to each other, etc..my wife has expressed a similar sentiment.

Oh don't kid yourself, this takes us one step closer to forcing everyone to gay marry. Whether you're gay or not. That's how this affects you and your marriage.

[MikeWaters]

I'll bet the food at a gay wedding would be incredible.

[ute4ever]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

I'll bet the food at a gay wedding would be incredible.

Why do you say that? My gay associates are some of the most slender people I know. I picture fruit (no pun), cheese and crackers, and lots of wine. Crates and crates of wine.

[landpoke]

Originally Posted by ute4ever

Why do you say that? My gay associates are some of the most slender people I know. I picture fruit (no pun), cheese and crackers, and lots of wine. Crates and crates of wine.

Another more horrific scenario would involve a gay couple into 70's kitsch. While the pigs-in-a-blanket would be ok, the exotic jello molds would put off all but the most hard-core Utah Mormon.

[NorCal Cat]

Originally Posted by TripletDaddy

This is my rationale, as well.

Heterosexual marriage is not harmed if homosexuals can get married.

My guess is that, politically speaking, it is in the Church's best interest to keep gay marriage illegal. Once it becomes legal, the Church faces heavier scrutiny for condemining it.

From an operational standpoint, legalized gay marriage does not impede the Church one bit, any more than legalized alcohol, abortions, or stores being open on Sunday. The Church and its members will still go about their business as before.

The Church already condemns homosexuality. I'm not sure that it would face more scrutiny for opposing gay marriage, just because it is legalized. The Church opposes lots of things that are legal.

Whether marriage is harmed or not by gay marriage is debatable. One could argue by changing the very definition of marriage in this way, will lessen the value of the institution as a whole.

One could also argue that gay marriage just further legitimizes a lifestyle that is condemned by God.

[TripletDaddy]

Originally Posted by NorCal Cat

The Church already condemns homosexuality. I'm not sure that it would face more scrutiny for opposing gay marriage, just because it is legalized. The Church opposes lots of things that are legal.

Whether marriage is harmed or not by gay marriage is debatable. One could argue by changing the very definition of marriage in this way, will lessen the value of the institution as a whole.

One could also argue that gay marriage just further legitimizes a lifestyle that is condemned by God.

What does this mean? It seems like nothing more than a platitude.

How does it lessen the value of a marriage?

If two guys get married in San Diego, the value of your marriage is lessened? How? Gay people in other countries can marry. Are you saying that heterosexual marriages in those countries are less valid or meaningful? Makes no sense, unless I am missing some huge point.

[NorCal Cat]

Originally Posted by TripletDaddy

What does this mean? It seems like nothing more than a platitude.

How does it lessen the value of a marriage?

If two guys get married in San Diego, the value of your marriage is lessened? How? Gay people in other countries can marry. Are you saying that heterosexual marriages in those countries are less valid or meaningful? Makes no sense, unless I am missing some huge point.

Yes, you are missing a huge point. The argument could be: Many people believe homosexuality is evil. Recognizing such behavior by allowing it to participate in the institution of marriage is going to cheapen the value of said institution. Furthermore, many people believe marriage was instituted by God, and they want to protect it from an homosexuality.

I'm not saying I agree 100% with the above, but the argument should be obvious to any Church member.

[TripletDaddy]

Originally Posted by NorCal Cat

Yes, you are missing a huge point. The argument could be: Many people believe homosexuality is evil. Recognizing such behavior by allowing it to participate in the institution of marriage is going to cheapen the value of said institution. Furthermore, many people believe marriage was instituted by God, and they want to protect it from an homosexuality.

I'm not saying I agree 100% with the above, but the argument should be obvious to any Church member.

The Church lets sinners be members.

It doesnt cheapen the institution.

You still do not explain HOW the value is cheapened. You just keep repeating that it would. walk me through your marriage, specifically. How does the value drop after gay marriage is legalized?

Marriage will not be affected, so no, I still dont see the point.

All of your reasons (not yours personally but the ones you provided) simply seem to reflect homophobia, not much else. There is no rationale to it.

[NorCal Cat]

Originally Posted by TripletDaddy

The Church lets sinners be members.

Not unrepentant people engaging in homosexual relations.

It doesnt cheapen the institution.

I heard you the first time, and it is still a matter of opinion.

You still do not explain HOW the value is cheapened. You just keep repeating that it would. walk me through your marriage, specifically. How does the value drop after gay marriage is legalized?

Marriage will not be affected, so no, I still dont see the point.

All of your reasons (not yours personally but the ones you provided) simply seem to reflect homophobia, not much else. There is no rationale to it.

The rationale is simple. It's as if the standards were lowered for something after you have achieved a previous, higher standard. For example, if the requirements for getting an M.D. were suddenly made easier, some existing M.D.s may be opposed to that.

Marriage will not be affected? It is very much affected in the sense that the definition is changing.