It realy is about religion ... - Page 6 - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

tooblue · 01-06-2008, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BarbaraGordon

Wow, that's one voter they quoted there. Hardly representative nor a majority.

I don't doubt that there exist voters who will not look past his religion. However, I think Romney's real challenge is that he alienates the average Midwest/Southern voter with his lack of charisma, his tremendous wealth, and even his intellect. It's fine to be smart, but you've got to play the part of the regular guy. Look at Obama. He's by any account incredibly intelligent. But he's not afraid to lower his diction and even take on a vernacular accent when necessary. It's fine to be wealthy, but you've got to pretend you're not. Look at Edwards. Tremendously affluent, yet spends all his time talking about saw mills. I honestly don't think Romney's interested in playing the part of the game where you pretend you're an average American. The truth is, the average American just plain doesn't run for president, so you've got an uphill battle convincing us you're one of "us." But if you want to connect with the voters, you've gotta try.

Analyst said it from the start. I refused to believe it. I do now. Romney's biggest 'real' challenge is his religion.

tooblue · 01-06-2008, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

Uh, you're the one who started psychoanlyzing apostates, calling them cowards for their beliefs. Still, I categorically deny that demonstrating how your comments are self-contradictory and illogical is making this thread about you.

Only after I and my supposed persecution complex had been made the focus of this thread. Go back and read it from the start Seattle.

tooblue · 01-06-2008, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tooblue

I am not portraying an attitude of victim hood, rather expressing my dismay at the reality of the whole situation ... 1 in 5 evangelicals voted for Romney ... 30% or more of voters have stated they will not vote for a Mormon and not because of 'those issues' as you call them.

It’s a sad day in America when such bigotry is left unchecked.

That is what I posted. I cite real evidence, not anecdotal evidence that fuels irrational fear. In response you told me to grow up.

woot · 01-06-2008, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tooblue

That is what I posted. I cite real evidence, not anecdotal evidence that fuels irrational fear. In response you told me to grow up.

But how does that 30% figure compare to the "would not vote for" figures for atheists, gays, blacks, women, republicans, democrats, jews, etc.? At least some of those will be significantly higher than the figure for Mormons.

Perhaps more importantly, you subjectively interpreted the statistic you cited as meaning that those people are bigots. We simply disagreed with that interpretation.

BarbaraGordon · 01-06-2008, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tooblue

Analyst said it from the start. I refused to believe it. I do now. Romney's biggest 'real' challenge is his religion.

It is clear that this is how you feel and I will not argue with you about it.

IIRC, a few of us last spring tried to discuss the many struggles Romney would face in the election, his faith being one of them.

woot · 01-06-2008, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BarbaraGordon

It is clear that this is how you feel and I will not argue with you about it.

IIRC, a few of us last spring tried to discuss the many struggles Romney would face in the election, his faith being one of them.

I can't express how much better your old avatar was than your new one.

Tex · 01-06-2008, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BarbaraGordon

Wow, that's one voter they quoted there. Hardly representative nor a majority.

I don't doubt that there exist voters who will not look past his religion. However, I think Romney's real challenge is that he alienates the average Midwest/Southern voter with his lack of charisma, his tremendous wealth, and even his intellect. It's fine to be smart, but you've got to play the part of the regular guy. Look at Obama. He's by any account incredibly intelligent. But he's not afraid to lower his diction and even take on a vernacular accent when necessary. It's fine to be wealthy, but you've got to pretend you're not. Look at Edwards. Tremendously affluent, yet spends all his time talking about saw mills. I honestly don't think Romney's interested in playing the part of the game where you pretend you're an average American. The truth is, the average American just plain doesn't run for president, so you've got an uphill battle convincing us you're one of "us." But if you want to connect with the voters, you've gotta try.

I think these are interesting comments, Barbara, because they don't describe me as a voter at all. I am completely turned off by Edwards' folksy "my father was a mill worker" routine. It strikes me as wholly fake. Obama doesn't strike me as fake in the same way, but when politicians pretend to be something they're not, it's a turn off. See Romney's "lifelong hunter" comment or John Kerry asking, "Is this where I get me a huntin' license?" Give me a break.

I also totally disagree with Huckabee's perspective, voiced to Jay Leno, that Americans are looking more for the guy they work with for President, rather than the guy that laid them off. I don't want any of my co-workers for President. And though I may or may not like my CEO, especially when I've been laid off (which I have), he's the guy creating jobs. I'd like someone at the top who understands business and economics. If our country has come to the point where Americans prefer Joe Blue Collar Worker making the World's Biggest Decisions, God help us.

Yes, the President needs to relate to the common man. But I truly don't understand this obsession with trying to make the common man President. I want the President to be an extraordinary person who has accomplished extraordinary things, because he's going to be faced with extraordinary decisions.

Romney may be a little over-polished, and he may have a bit of a position problem, but I think I could trust him with his finger on The Button, his judgment on Supreme Court nominees, or his hand in the nation's fiscal affairs. John Edwards? Ha.

MikeWaters · 01-06-2008, 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

Romney may be a little over-polished, and he may have a bit of a position problem, but I think I could trust him with his finger on The Button, his judgment on Supreme Court nominees, or his hand in the nation's fiscal affairs. John Edwards? Ha.

And this is exactly why Americans are rejecting Romney. Because they know that when that time comes, there won't be advisers and focus groups enough to tell him what to do.

McCain has stuck with his unpopular beliefs, and is being rewarded.

Genuineness is very important to Americans. And Romney has not been able to pull off the switcheroo, like some other politicians have.

tooblue · 01-06-2008, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woot

But how does that 30% figure compare to the "would not vote for" figures for atheists, gays, blacks, women, republicans, democrats, jews, etc.? At least some of those will be significantly higher than the figure for Mormons.

Perhaps more importantly, you subjectively interpreted the statistic you cited as meaning that those people are bigots. We simply disagreed with that interpretation.

We are talking about the republican party and the base evangelical voters who make up the party. There's no subjectivity to be applied when the answer to the question is; "I will not vote for a Mormon." it is NOT an interpretation. 30% SPECIFICALLY stated they would NOT VOTE FOR A MORMON!