Oil in America

[Tex]

Originally Posted by BlueK

Sure, dropping in more supply will affect the price. But it will not make any difference in the geo political game. It may not even affect the price that much as OPEC can still play games to drive it back up. It's debateable at best.

Originally Posted by BlueK

It's not a solution if the net result is basically zero, which is what it will be.

It's "debateable" and yet "will be zero", eh?

[BlueK]

Originally Posted by Tex

It's "debateable" and yet "will be zero", eh?

whatever, have fun with your semantics games. Weak, even for you.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by BlueK

whatever, have fun with your semantics games. Weak, even for you.

Heh, it was fun actually.

We get it already. You think no amount of oil produced from American oil fields is going to have any appreciable impact on world markets. I think you're up-in-the-night crazy, but we get it.

[BlueK]

Originally Posted by Tex

Heh, it was fun actually.

We get it already. You think no amount of oil produced from American oil fields is going to have any appreciable impact on world markets. I think you're up-in-the-night crazy, but we get it.

So you think the economists at the Cato institute are up in the night crazy as well. This is good political rhetoric and nothing else. Just because John Kerry, Obama and George Bush are on the bandwagon doesn't mean they're right. The argument for oil independence is about is strong as the argument for everyone filling up on Monday or Wednesday but boycotting gas stations on Tuesday. It won't be until the actual consumption of oil drops that the middle east will become less relevant. Sure, throwing more supply in there will have some effect on the market, but hardly enough to tell the middle east to take a hike.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by BlueK

So you think the economists at the Cato institute are up in the night crazy as well. This is good political rhetoric and nothing else. Just because John Kerry, Obama and George Bush are on the bandwagon doesn't mean they're right. The argument for oil independence is about is strong as the argument for everyone filling up on Monday or Wednesday but boycotting gas stations on Tuesday. It won't be until the actual consumption of oil drops that the middle east will become less relevant. Sure, throwing more supply in there will have some effect on the market, but hardly enough to tell the middle east to take a hike.

I'm not sure the US is ever going to "tell the middle east to take a hike." There are political ties that go beyond basic oil money. But I disagree that more supply (or even the perception of more supply) won't put downward pressure on market prices. And I also disagree that it won't give us some leverage politically.

I don't have time today to read through your Cato link, but if they're saying what you say they're saying, then yes, I think they're crazy too. They aren't the only opinion in the field.

[BlueK]

Originally Posted by Tex

I'm not sure the US is ever going to "tell the middle east to take a hike." There are political ties that go beyond basic oil money. But I disagree that more supply (or even the perception of more supply) won't put downward pressure on market prices. And I also disagree that it won't give us some leverage politically.

I don't have time today to read through your Cato link, but if they're saying what you say they're saying, then yes, I think they're crazy too. They aren't the only opinion in the field.

Please provide a contrasting opinion not from a politician or political commentator but from someone who understands the economy of the oil market. Good luck. I'd love to read it and discuss.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by BlueK

Please provide a contrasting opinion not from a politician or political commentator but from someone who understands the economy of the oil market. Good luck. I'd love to read it and discuss.

I don't have it at my fingertips, but I'll look around.

In the meantime, Democrats are countering Bush/McCain's call for more drilling with a proposal to nationalize oil refineries so as to better "control oil supply."

LOL. The Dems may hand us the election yet.

[Indy Coug]

Originally Posted by Tex

In the meantime, Democrats are countering Bush/McCain's call for more drilling with a proposal to nationalize oil refineries so as to better "control oil supply."

That is terrifying.

[Venkman]

I haven't read every post, but AMEN, Tex and Indy. We're living paycheck to paycheck when it comes to oil. Supply is tighter than (insert GN-type analogy). Any hiccup in supply (hurricane, terrorism, etc.) and oil prices double or worse. This is not good. I'm in favor of drilling more. I'm also in favor of going nuclear and using the coal that currently goes towards electricity and turning it to petroleum.

I believe the current price of oil is somewhat of a bubble, but that's not the full story. Congress opening up ANWR and off-coast drilling will have an almost immediate impact on the price of oil, because it will lessen some of the fear and uncertainty surrounding future supply.

Finally, yes I'm in favor of conservation and developing alternate sources of energy. I'm also not opposed to a government funded "Manhattan Project" for energy, provided we increase oil supply in the meantime. Conservation, nuclear, renewable energy, AND more oil. That's the answer IMO.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Originally Posted by Venkman

I haven't read every post, but AMEN, Tex and Indy. We're living paycheck to paycheck when it comes to oil. Supply is tighter than (insert GN-type analogy). Any hiccup in supply (hurricane, terrorism, etc.) and oil prices double or worse. This is not good. I'm in favor of drilling more. I'm also in favor of going nuclear and using the coal that currently goes towards electricity and turning it to petroleum.

I believe the current price of oil is somewhat of a bubble, but that's not the full story. Congress opening up ANWR and off-coast drilling will have an almost immediate impact on the price of oil, because it will lessen some of the fear and uncertainty surrounding future supply.

Finally, yes I'm in favor of conservation and developing alternate sources of energy. I'm also not opposed to a government funded "Manhattan Project" for energy, provided we increase oil supply in the meantime. Conservation, nuclear, renewable energy, AND more oil. That's the answer IMO.

I agree with most of this. I am not sure coal gasification will ever be much help. I think coal is best utilized for power generation. We need better plug-in hybrids and Chevy-Volt type cars to take advantage of electricity produced from all sources, including coal. I also think we need to start building lots of nuclear plants ASAP.