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Mindfulcoug · 07-31-2007, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

In addition to what Arch said, the opinions of uninformed and uneducated people languishing under totalitarian regimes do not concern me, so far as moral high ground is concerned.

As I've said repeatedly, we already have it.

mindfulcoug is an example of uninformed and uneducated person who is languishing under totalitarian regimes ,using almost free ADSL internet having a BS in microbiology and a MS in Immunology , staying up late at night with her husband smiling at her (while preparing for his board exam in gastroenterology subspecialty ) and kid snoring ..i really appreciate your commiseration sister Tex.

Mindfulcoug · 07-31-2007, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

mindful, can you post a picture of yourself? I'm curious to know what you look like.

with or without burqa ?

Tex · 07-31-2007, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mindfulcoug

mindfulcoug is an example of uninformed and uneducated person who is languishing under totalitarian regimes ,using almost free ADSL internet having a BS in microbiology and a MS in Immunology , staying up late at night with her husband smiling at her (while preparing for his board exam in gastroenterology subspecialty ) and kid snoring ..i really appreciate your commiseration sister Tex.

I would say you are not the example of an uninformed and uneducated person from your region, and that your pedigree is not typical.

BlueHair · 08-01-2007, 12:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

In addition to what Arch said, the opinions of uninformed and uneducated people languishing under totalitarian regimes do not concern me, so far as moral high ground is concerned.

As I've said repeatedly, we already have it.

Nice. Is there a broader brush you could paint with? What makes you think that Iranian people are any less educated than we are? I would think mindfulcoug would be way more educated as to what goes on inside of Iran than we are. What makes you think Iranians know less about Iran than you? All we hear is what our government tells us. I would say they are less than a good source based on the lies (or bad intelligence if you prefer) they told us about Iraq.

I love my country. I am saddened that we've taken the Imperialist approach and we're becoming a society that loves to let the government control almost every part of our lives. I still wouldn't trade it for any other country. Why can't we allow other countries to feel the same way? Why can't we let them choose their own government. If there ever comes a time when they feel they want a change, let them change it. No government can deny the will of its citizens forever. Let them buy a revolution with their own blood, sweat, and tears. If they want it, let them earn it. If they don't, we should just let them be. I'm not sure because I've never lived there, but there is a possibility that they like their form of government. Maybe they don't want the sin (in their religious view) that comes with our form of government. Hell, we have people on this board who would die if our citizens had the freedom that Libertarians want. Just imagine how hard it would be for the Iranians to take an even bigger leap.

Tex · 08-01-2007, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueHair

Nice. Is there a broader brush you could paint with? What makes you think that Iranian people are any less educated than we are? I would think mindfulcoug would be way more educated as to what goes on inside of Iran than we are. What makes you think Iranians know less about Iran than you? All we hear is what our government tells us. I would say they are less than a good source based on the lies (or bad intelligence if you prefer) they told us about Iraq.

Nope, I prefer a broad brush on this. Please don't tell me you're comparing Iran to America.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueHair

I love my country. I am saddened that we've taken the Imperialist approach and we're becoming a society that loves to let the government control almost every part of our lives. I still wouldn't trade it for any other country. Why can't we allow other countries to feel the same way? Why can't we let them choose their own government. If there ever comes a time when they feel they want a change, let them change it. No government can deny the will of its citizens forever. Let them buy a revolution with their own blood, sweat, and tears. If they want it, let them earn it. If they don't, we should just let them be. I'm not sure because I've never lived there, but there is a possibility that they like their form of government. Maybe they don't want the sin (in their religious view) that comes with our form of government. Hell, we have people on this board who would die if our citizens had the freedom that Libertarians want. Just imagine how hard it would be for the Iranians to take an even bigger leap.

Oooh baby, what a utopian outlook. Quickly:

- Other countries are welcome to feel patriotic. They aren't welcome to breed hate and violence against the United States.
- No gov't may be able to deny the will of its citizens forever, but it can for a very long time.
- I operate from the basic premise that democracy (or republicanism, if you prefer) is a superior form of government to any other out there. No other form of gov't is less likely to foment rebellion and violence.
- I don't know what "freedom that Libertarians want" you're talking about, but I can't think of anything a Libertarian could do that would actually, literally want me to cause my own death.

BlueHair · 08-01-2007, 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

Nope, I prefer a broad brush on this. Please don't tell me you're comparing Iran to America.

Oooh baby, what a utopian outlook. Quickly:

- Other countries are welcome to feel patriotic. They aren't welcome to breed hate and violence against the United States.
- No gov't may be able to deny the will of its citizens forever, but it can for a very long time.
- I operate from the basic premise that democracy (or republicanism, if you prefer) is a superior form of government to any other out there. No other form of gov't is less likely to foment rebellion and violence.
- I don't know what "freedom that Libertarians want" you're talking about, but I can't think of anything a Libertarian could do that would actually, literally want me to cause my own death.

I'm not comparing Iran to the United States. That is exactly my point. What works for us, will most likely not work for them. They don't want our government. If a change comes, it must come from the inside Iran to be successful. They will not agree to a foreign nation changing their government. To say that we know what's better for them than they do is beyond arrogant.

I'll give you one example of a freedom Libertarians want. Legalized drugs. Religious people think our society would fall apart if, God forbid, you gave people authority to put in their bodies whatever they choose. Why can you not understand that they view our way of life in the same way? They think we are sinful and out of control. They do not want that. They enjoy having a government that is sync with their cultural and religious views.

BYU71 · 08-01-2007, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mindfulcoug

fascinating reasoning and intoxicating conclusion!
i always forget that part which says " we are animal ,living in animal kingdom and one who is stronger survives "..
i only wish you hadnot carry BYU name which i have got to be proud of knowing it.

I am sorry, but I don't quite get your response. I think the first sentence is sarcastic. I couldn't think of a more politically correct way of saying it. Perhaps I should have started with, "Sadly and I certainly wish this wasn't true, but I believe we are....................and one who is stronger survives."

As far as carrying the BYU name, I don't quite get that either. As for me, individuals and their comments or actions neither make me proud or embarassed for BYU. Contrary to popular opinion, BYU's fans and alumni are not the Borg and have varying opinions.

As an example, I am not fond of the Iranian President, however that does not make me dislike the Iranian people. Quite to the contrary. It was a long time ago, but when I first graduated and worked for a National Accounting firm, an Iranian became one of my closest colleques and friends. Funny, but we never discussed religion. I assume he was Muslim and I don't know if he even knew what a Mormon is.

Tex · 08-01-2007, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

If true, it would be great news. Are you hoping for a debate on that point?

Oops.

Quote:

Democratic House Whip James Clyburn says a positive report from Iraq forces commander General David Petraeus to Congress in September would be — "a real problem for us."

Clyburn tells The Washington Post that an upbeat assessment of the war from Petraeus would likely split House Democrats — making their goal of forcing a timetable to end the war impossible. Clyburn says Petraeus' words will carry significant weight among the 47 Blue Dog Caucus members — and without their support — a timetable is probably out of reach.

Clyburn is advising other Democratic leaders to wait until Petraeus' report before making their next move in their battle with the president over the future of U.S. troops in the region.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,291634,00.html