Beer and the Word of Wisdom

[Indy Coug]

The relevant issue at hand isn't what is or isn't on the verboten list and whether or not it is logical, consistent or constitutes the greatest physical and spiritual threat to us.

What is relevant is faith and obedience. There is nothing prohibiting anyone from seeking to find hidden treasures of what other things will improve our health in addition to adhering to the verboten list.

[jay santos]

Originally Posted by Sleeping in EQ

Many adults (at least in the English-speaking church) are vaguely aware of how things have changed. They know that Brigham Young made it more commandment-ish in 1851 and so on. But they don't know about all the back and forth, or how it wasn't connected to Temple worthiness for a long time.

I think that any Church History class that wants to give a broad understanding of changing Mormon doctrine and practices should trace the material in those articles that Solon cited.

For the record, I was taught this stuff in a Teachings of the Prophets class at BYU.

Thanks for the link, Solon.

[Flystripper]

Originally Posted by tooblue

Of course if we are talking about American beer then we are talking about a 'mild drink' at 3.2%.

Now if we are talking Canadian beer at 5 - 6% ...

only Utah Beer is 3.2%

[Sleeping in EQ]

Originally Posted by jay santos

For the record, I was taught this stuff in a Teachings of the Prophets class at BYU.

Thanks for the link, Solon.

That's good to know.

[BYU71]

This reminds me about talking to a friend out at the course the other day.

This guy isn't active at all, but loves BYU football. Anyway we got talking about going to the Vegas game. He said if we go together we need to get tickets away from BYU fans because he is going to have a beer or two. I said, no big deal. He said it is an old habit.

When he was a teenager his Dad told him to go get some beer. He said he was going to go to the local store and his mom said, you can't go there. You know your Dad is the Bishop. You have to go over and buy it in Millard.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by Solon

The way I see it, enforcement is different from changing what the text indicates. I don't think anyone could make an argument that whiskey or cigars were acceptable just because the WoW was loosely "enforced," but I do think the text says that beer is okay. Is the church prohibiting something for which there is no doctrinal / revelatory reason?

Sure. Blacks and the priesthood was nothing more than codified prophetic racism. Prophets have also apparently misread and mistaught the "sexual sin: 2nd most serious" doctrine for decades. Why not add beer to the list of extra-doctrinal policies they've created?

Originally Posted by Solon

I wonder if this is what happens when a semi- or pseudo-doctrinal tradition becomes entrenched over time. Are we 75 years away from a temple recommend question that asks if the member watches "Rated R" movies, since at some point it "became" a bona fide commandment?

Has the prophet called for a sustaining vote on codifying this heretofore recommendation?

[BYU71]

Originally Posted by Tex

Sure. Blacks and the priesthood was nothing more than codified prophetic racism. Prophets have also apparently misread and mistaught the "sexual sin: 2nd most serious" doctrine for decades. Why not add beer to the list of extra-doctrinal policies they've created?



Has the prophet called for a sustaining vote on codifying this heretofore recommendation?

Do you think it is possible that some of the commandments we have are traditional or cultural and can change, but most are the kind that will never change.

[jay santos]

Originally Posted by Solon

The way I see it, enforcement is different from changing what the text indicates. I don't think anyone could make an argument that whiskey or cigars were acceptable just because the WoW was loosely "enforced," but I do think the text says that beer is okay. Is the church prohibiting something for which there is no doctrinal / revelatory reason?

I wonder if this is what happens when a semi- or pseudo-doctrinal tradition becomes entrenched over time. Are we 75 years away from a temple recommend question that asks if the member watches "Rated R" movies, since at some point it "became" a bona fide commandment?

I think we as members could create a lot of angst for ourselves if we combed through temple worthiness issues and had to correlate each one to a specific, public revelation. Where do you find anything on heroin? Abortion? Child support? Ten commandments say thou shalt not steal, but is there a specific level that would make me temple unworthy? i.e. if I tell my bishop I downloaded a song illegally off Limewire, he probably wouldn't take my recommend, but if I was arrested for felony embezzlement, he would.

Saying you could drink beer and honestly answer a bishop's WoW question in temple recommend is completely wrong.

[MikeWaters]

What does the handbook, our 5th scripture, say about the WoW?

[non sequitur]

Originally Posted by Flystripper

only Utah Beer is 3.2%

Not exactly true. I'm in Denver, and the beer you buy in the supermarkets here is also 3.2%. As in Utah, you can go to a liquor store and buy stronger beer, but it will cost you more. There are also several states in the south where 3.2% beer is the norm. And while Canadian beers are a bit stronger than U.S. beers, they're not in the same ballpark as European beers -- particularly some of the German and Belgian beers.

It's a about time there was a thread in this forum that I knew something about.