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Old 05-13-2009, 12:00 AM   #41
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Originally Posted by Cali Coug View Post
I accept your surrender.
It's not a surrender. I'm happy to discuss it with anyone else.
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Old 05-13-2009, 03:46 PM   #42
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What--now for the next 4-8 years there's no discussion allowed about how nonsensically loyal blacks are to the Democrats, no matter how they abuse them?

Funny that one of Obama and the Democrat Congress's first acts was to revoke DC school vouchers, which helped place lots of black kids in better schools. I think they finally got enough negative press that they cancelled the change before it was final.

Liberalism is one of the chief culprits of the destruction of the black family, and yet they just keep coming back for more.
I think much of that has to do with the fact that they encounter much more racism among conservatives and that the democrats tend to favor the little guy more.
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Old 05-13-2009, 04:35 PM   #43
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I think much of that has to do with the fact that they encounter much more racism among conservatives and that the democrats tend to favor the little guy more.
Conservatives are no more racist than liberals. Liberals just hide their racism.

And if they favor the little guy so much, why do liberals try to limit individual freedom?
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Old 05-13-2009, 06:30 PM   #44
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Conservatives are no more racist than liberals. Liberals just hide their racism.
I agree with you to some extent. Malcolm X said, the conservative is the wolf and the liberal is the fox. With the wolf, at least you know he's out to get you. With the fox, you never know when he'll backstab you.

When I was an intern in DC back in 2004, I talked to this black man at institute who used to lobby for civil rights in 70s. He said it was easier to work with conservatives. They'll tell you "no way" initially, but later they open up, and out of Southern honor they deliver.

With liberal politicians on the other hand, they make you all these promises, and after they can't deliver, they make up some excuse like, "I tried to work it into the language, but couldn't..."
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Old 05-13-2009, 06:34 PM   #45
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I agree with you to some extent. Malcolm X said, the conservative is the wolf and the liberal is the fox. With the wolf, at least you know he's out to get you. With the fox, you never know when he'll backstab you.

When I was an intern in DC back in 2004, I talked to this black man at institute who used to lobby for civil rights in 70s. He said it was easier to work with conservatives. They'll tell you "no way" initially, but later they open up, and out of Southern honor they deliver.

With liberal politicians on the other hand, they make you all these promises, and after they can't deliver, they make up some excuse like, "I tried to work it into the language, but couldn't..."
I've heard things like this as well. While racism is ugly, I'm sure minorities would rather know up front about it, rather than learn afterward.
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Old 07-05-2011, 08:27 PM   #46
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And the other shoe drops.

Anti-Mormon bias persists, notably among Democrats

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Ever since Mitt Romney's unsuccessful run for the 2008 Republican presidential nomination, there's been much discussion of whether GOP voters would accept a Mormon candidate. Would evangelical conservatives, in particular, look past the former Massachusetts governor's faith to vote for him? The underlying assumption was that the more conservative the views, the more intolerant the voter.

Now, it turns out a better question might be whether Democratic voters would accept a Mormon candidate. In a survey that cuts against the media stereotype, a new Gallup Poll has found that more Democrats than Republicans say they would not vote for a Mormon for president. Twenty-seven percent of Democrats say they wouldn't vote for a Mormon, while 18 percent of Republicans say the same. For independents, the figure is 19 percent.
Although it apparently isn't a new thing, as Ramesh Ponnuru points out in a 2007 column:

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Romney, at least in his 2007 version, is the most conventionally conservative. If elected, he could make a fine president. But he has a big disadvantage as a presidential candidate: He is a Mormon. In December, a FoxNews poll found that 32 percent of voters would be less likely to vote for a candidate if he were Mormon. Speculation about the effect of Romney’s Mormonism on his chances has centered on evangelical Christians’ theological differences with him. But evangelicals were only slightly more hostile to Mormon candidates than the population at large. Democrats were much more hostile. So even if Romney’s conservative social positions get him through the primaries, his religion is a liability in the general election. (It may be that many secular-minded voters consider Mormonism particularly alien and threatening.)
Unfortunately, he doesn't provide a link to the Fox News poll so we can see just how hostile "much more hostile" really is. But we have today's Gallup numbers.
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Last edited by Tex; 07-05-2011 at 08:31 PM.
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Old 07-05-2011, 09:27 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by Tex View Post
And the other shoe drops.

Anti-Mormon bias persists, notably among Democrats



Although it apparently isn't a new thing, as Ramesh Ponnuru points out in a 2007 column:



Unfortunately, he doesn't provide a link to the Fox News poll so we can see just how hostile "much more hostile" really is. But we have today's Gallup numbers.
I hypothesize the change is due to 1) Prop 8 creating more opposition from Democrats and 2) Glenn Beck cutting a chunk out of the Evangelical opposition.

Nonetheless, the fact remains: Evangelical Christians are dumb and ignorant.
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Old 07-05-2011, 10:36 PM   #48
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I hypothesize the change is due to 1) Prop 8 creating more opposition from Democrats and 2) Glenn Beck cutting a chunk out of the Evangelical opposition.
You might have a point, if it weren't for Ponnuru's earlier column. I dug up the Dec 2006 poll I think(?) he was referring to:

Quote:
Does the fact that Romney is a Mormon make you more or less likely to vote for him for president?
Less likely, Dem: 30%
Less likely, Rep: 23%
Less likely, Evangelical: 28%
and this:

Quote:
I'm going to read you some religious affiliations and I'd like you to tell me whether you think that affiliation would make you more or less likely to vote for the candidate.

Mormon
Less likely, Dem: 38%
Less likely, Rep: 32%
Less likely, general public: 32%
This, before anyone had heard of Prop 8, and Glenn Beck was still at CNN.

It seems Democrats have been measurably as bigoted toward Mormons as evangelicals (if not more so) since at least 2006. Certainly more so than Republicans or the general public.
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Last edited by Tex; 07-05-2011 at 10:38 PM.
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Old 07-05-2011, 11:29 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tex View Post
You might have a point, if it weren't for Ponnuru's earlier column. I dug up the Dec 2006 poll I think(?) he was referring to:



and this:



This, before anyone had heard of Prop 8, and Glenn Beck was still at CNN.

It seems Democrats have been measurably as bigoted toward Mormons as evangelicals (if not more so) since at least 2006. Certainly more so than Republicans or the general public.
I want to see the % NO for Evangelicals is. Wonder why Gallup didn't pick it up. The best they have is Protestant at 23% NO, and that would certainly be lower than the Evangelical %. In spite of all the praise I hear from Evangelicals about Beck, the % doesn't seem to have changed much.
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Old 07-06-2011, 01:13 AM   #50
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It wouldn't surprise me if a number of liberal democrats are inclined to be against Mormon candidates. Because they are perceived as being arch-right wing conservatives (even if the facts don't generally bear this out always).

It's kind of like asking Mormons if they like candidates who are affiliated with the ACLU.

But my experience in life suggests to me that there is all kinds of Mormon bias: among the uneducated and the educated, rich and poor, left and right.
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