It realy is about religion ...

[woot]

Originally Posted by tooblue

You attacked me from the get go. Your intent was not to engage my idea but to tell me what a fool I am. It's that simple.

That's simply not true. Even if it were true, it's extremely obvious that you prefer it to be about you, as you continually ignore everything I say about your idea.

[SeattleUte]

Tooblue, what do you call labeling people cowards simply for believing differently from you? LOL. I think the pot is calling the kettle black.

Guess what, some folks out there have simply concluded in good faith that Joseph Smith was a liar or a megalomaniac or wanted a lot of sex or whatever, but he certainly didn't see Jesus or translate any golden plates. On top of that they believe he did some imoral things. And they didn't reach those conclusions for any other reason than by application of their critical faculties.

BTW, I would never call Mormons cowards. I think pervasive underdeveloped critical faculties is more like it.

[tooblue]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

All I said is Mormons should reflect on why they are unpopular. Look, I give Waters points at least for consistently. He says Mormons should be indifferent to worldly opinion. My advice is for people like you and Mitt Romney who seem to think it matters or care whether the world likes you for your beliefs.

That's where you truly fail to understand me (I can't speak for Romney). It's irrelevant whether or not you like my beliefs -but they should not get in the way of the opportunity to get to know me and whether or not you can like me.

To put it in context Seattle ... I don't like your beliefs, but I have not let them get in the way of liking you, at least the Internet persona that is you. In other words I refuse to let my bigotry for apostates get in the way of getting to know you and apreciating the value of what you bring to this message board.

[tooblue]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

Tooblue, what do you call labeling people cowards simply for believing differently from you? LOL. I think the pot is calling the kettle black.

Guess what, some folks out there have simply concluded in good faith that Joseph Smith was a liar or a megalomaniac or wanted a lot of sex or whatever, but he certainly didn't see Jesus or translate any golden plates. On top of that they believe he did some imoral things. And they didn't reach those conclusions for any other reason than by application of their critical faculties.

BTW, I would never call Mormons cowards. I think pervasive underdeveloped critical faculties is more like it.

Imbeciles would be a more succinct way for you to label Mormons.

The intersting thing is, you don't truly believe differently than I do. However the application of your beliefs is markedly different as compard to me. I consider it a form of cowardice.

[woot]

Originally Posted by tooblue

It's irrelevant whether or not you like my beliefs -but they should not get in the way of the opportunity to get to know me and whether or not you can like me.

Is that what this is all about? Even after I explained to you that just about everyone I associate with in my personal life are Mormons?

Tooblue, you have a severe persecution complex. Your craziest ideas, as you've quite thoroughly demonstrated on this forum, are outside of your Mormon beliefs, so your religion is obviously not entirely responsible for your unreason. You've admitted that you bask in the absurd, and find satisfaction in believing the irrational. To claim bigotry as your default response under such circumstances seems, well, absurd.

[tooblue]

Originally Posted by woot

That's simply not true. Even if it were true, it's extremely obvious that you prefer it to be about you, as you continually ignore everything I say about your idea.

It is true ... this entire thread is about bigotry -I said nothing about myslef in the initial post. Others who have chimed in, including you, have tried to make this discussion about me instead of about religous bigotry.

[UtahDan]

Originally Posted by tooblue

That's where you truly fail to understand me (I can't speak for Romney). It's irrelevant whether or not you like my beliefs -but they should not get in the way of the opportunity to get to know me and whether or not you can like me.

I'm certainly not on Seattle's side here, but let me play devil's advocate with you here for a moment. If I can't make decisions about you based on your beliefs, then how am I supposed to use to evaluate you. I know that you mean religious beliefs, but think about why religious beliefs ought to have an exempt status.

To me, the bottom line is that it is not illegitimate to make judgments about a person based on what they believe. Any number of extreme analogies demonstrate this. We shouldn't get our feelings hurt that evangelicals think we are wacky. We think they are wacky. Its not bigotry, its the subjective exercise of judgment, IMO.

[tooblue]

Originally Posted by woot

Is that what this is all about? Even after I explained to you that just about everyone I associate with in my personal life are Mormons?

Tooblue, you have a severe persecution complex. Your craziest ideas, as you've quite thoroughly demonstrated on this forum, are outside of your Mormon beliefs, so your religion is obviously not entirely responsible for your unreason. You've admitted that you bask in the absurd, and find satisfaction in believing the irrational. To claim bigotry as your default response under such circumstances seems, well, absurd.

This thread is about bigotry and has been turned into a thread about me -I don't need healing etc. I will however continue to point out bigotry in an event that has captivated my attention.

[tooblue]

Originally Posted by UtahDan

I'm certainly not on Seattle's side here, but let me play devil's advocate with you here for a moment. If I can't make decisions about you based on your beliefs, then how am I supposed to use to evaluate you. I know that you mean religious beliefs, but think about why religious beliefs ought to have an exempt status.

To me, the bottom line is that it is not illegitimate to make judgments about a person based on what they believe. Any number of extreme analogies demonstrate this. We shouldn't get our feelings hurt that evangelicals think we are wacky. We think they are wacky. Its not bigotry, its the subjective exercise of judgment, IMO.

It's not about given exempt status to religous beliefs -it's about looking past them where possible. Certainly we can agree that Mormonism is not equatable and certainly more complex and compelling that the giant spagetti god of internet lore.

The reality is people in general are not permitted, or do not permit themselves to get to the point of judging whether they like someone based upon what they believe because they permit prior assumptions attached to the label of Mormon to make that determinatiion for them.

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by tooblue

This thread is about bigotry and has been turned into a thread about me -I don't need healing etc. I will however continue to point out bigotry in an event that has captivated my attention.

Uh, you're the one who started psychoanlyzing apostates, calling them cowards for their beliefs. Still, I categorically deny that demonstrating how your comments are self-contradictory and illogical is making this thread about you.