adultery in the church

[Tex]

Originally Posted by jay santos

I can't speak for everyone but I find the variance in local leadership a real issue. I would like more consistency. Me personally, I probably am not going to care if my bishop tells me to do something dumb or tells me something I disagree with. But a lot of people especially young people are affected greatly by their bishop.

I think the direction the missionary program has taken over the decades is a good example of the direction the church is moving on these things. Years and years ago, my father had a set of lessons he would memorize and they had to be delivered as such ... word for word.

Later when I served a mission we were given discussions, encouraged to stay with the lines drawn, but had flexibility to cover principles in a way and at a pace the spirit directed.

Now we have Preach My Gospel, a completely decentralized system of teaching the gospel. The missionaries have broad discretion as to how and when they teach which principles, and memorization and recitation is strictly discouraged. Corresponding to this new program, we have an admonition from the brethren to raise the bar on new missionaries.

I've studied the new manual and really like it, so much so that I wish we had it when I was serving. At the same time, it makes old dogs like me nervous because I remember some of the questionable teaching skills of my fellow missionaries and I worry about the free-form curriculum.

In the end, we are a church of revelation more than anything. The handbook is a couple hundred pages when it could easily be a couple thousand. We are given general guidelines on most things (and strict guidelines on a few), but we are largely left to ourselves and our spiritual sensitivities to lead the church at local levels.

While this opens a door for abuse and mediocrity, in the end I think it does more good than evil. It encourages (some might say requires) the highest aspirations of spirituality on the part of our leaders.

[cougjunkie]

i have a very good friend that is an RM, got married at 23 and started having some problems with porn. His wife and him were a very touchy couple almost to the point of it being uncomfortable, but she caught him looking at porn one day and freaked out on him. She completely lost it and moved out. He started counseling with the bishop, but it takes time obviously.

Well she decided that she couldnt handle having a husband that disgusting and that she could never look at him the same again, she said he would always look at her as a slut and not as his wife

So she divorced him, and her family told her she made the right decision.

After about a year he saw her at a mutual friends party for the first time since the divorce was final, they actually started hanging out, but SHE told him she didnt want to start dating because it would be to hard to not have sex with him since they had done it before

So they quit dating, havent talked in about a year, and he is dating another girl and he is fully repented of his porn problems. His wife is still single, bitter, and hasnt dated anyone seriously since, but still emails my friend constantly.

[ute4ever]

Originally Posted by cougjunkie

...she caught him looking at porn one day and freaked out on him. She completely lost it and moved out.
...she decided that she couldnt handle having a husband that disgusting
...she said he would always look at her as a slut and not as his wife
...she divorced him,
...[she] is still single, bitter, and hasnt dated anyone seriously since

When I am asked what plans I have for the evening or weekend, every often I say "same old same old: drugs, alcohol and porn."

Non-LDS girls usually laugh at the obvious sarcasm.

LDS girls look uncomfortable because not only did I say the p-word, but I associated myself with it.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Originally Posted by cougjunkie

i have a very good friend that is an RM, got married at 23 and started having some problems with porn. His wife and him were a very touchy couple almost to the point of it being uncomfortable, but she caught him looking at porn one day and freaked out on him. She completely lost it and moved out. He started counseling with the bishop, but it takes time obviously.

Well she decided that she couldnt handle having a husband that disgusting and that she could never look at him the same again, she said he would always look at her as a slut and not as his wife

So she divorced him, and her family told her she made the right decision.

After about a year he saw her at a mutual friends party for the first time since the divorce was final, they actually started hanging out, but SHE told him she didnt want to start dating because it would be to hard to not have sex with him since they had done it before

So they quit dating, havent talked in about a year, and he is dating another girl and he is fully repented of his porn problems. His wife is still single, bitter, and hasnt dated anyone seriously since, but still emails my friend constantly.

What a tragic overreaction.

[marsupial]

Can someone explain to me how porn leads to adultery? That is, sex with a real, woman (or man) with a pulse? My guess is that plenty of the people cheating on their spouses would never consider looking at porn, but may think going out to lunch alone with a coworker of the opposite sex is harmless.

Also, I don't think that porn consumption necessarily puts you on the slippery slope to adultery.

(Reading this back to myself it sounds like I am a fan of porn. For the record, I am not. I just don't see the cause and effect link. I have always believed affairs happen when a spouse starts investing more time and energy in a "friendship" outside of the marriage.)

[cougjunkie]

Originally Posted by marsupial

Can someone explain to me how porn leads to adultery? That is, sex with a real, woman (or man) with a pulse? My guess is that plenty of the people cheating on their spouses would never consider looking at porn, but may think going out to lunch alone with a coworker of the opposite sex is harmless.

Also, I don't think that porn consumption necessarily puts you on the slippery slope to adultery.

(Reading this back to myself it sounds like I am a fan of porn. For the record, I am not. I just don't see the cause and effect link. I have always believed affairs happen when a spouse starts investing more time and energy in a "friendship" outside of the marriage.)

How a bishop explained it in EQ once:

Porn leads to impure thoughts, which leads to masturbation, which leads to "what if" scenarios going through your head, which leads to "just this once", which leads to full blow adultery.

It went something like that.

[Jeff Lebowski]

Originally Posted by marsupial

Can someone explain to me how porn leads to adultery? That is, sex with a real, woman (or man) with a pulse? My guess is that plenty of the people cheating on their spouses would never consider looking at porn, but may think going out to lunch alone with a coworker of the opposite sex is harmless.

Also, I don't think that porn consumption necessarily puts you on the slippery slope to adultery.

(Reading this back to myself it sounds like I am a fan of porn. For the record, I am not. I just don't see the cause and effect link. I have always believed affairs happen when a spouse starts investing more time and energy in a "friendship" outside of the marriage.)

I have a good friend who is a full-time therapist. He spends most of his time dealing with addictions, porn included. He says that the porn-adultery link is greatly exaggerated. It happens, but in the vast majority of cases it doesn't.

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by cougjunkie

i have a very good friend that is an RM, got married at 23 and started having some problems with porn. His wife and him were a very touchy couple almost to the point of it being uncomfortable, but she caught him looking at porn one day and freaked out on him. She completely lost it and moved out. He started counseling with the bishop, but it takes time obviously.

Well she decided that she couldnt handle having a husband that disgusting and that she could never look at him the same again, she said he would always look at her as a slut and not as his wife

So she divorced him, and her family told her she made the right decision.

After about a year he saw her at a mutual friends party for the first time since the divorce was final, they actually started hanging out, but SHE told him she didnt want to start dating because it would be to hard to not have sex with him since they had done it before

So they quit dating, havent talked in about a year, and he is dating another girl and he is fully repented of his porn problems. His wife is still single, bitter, and hasnt dated anyone seriously since, but still emails my friend constantly.

If this story is true (it's hard to believe), and the whole story on the divorce the wife is a complete loon. (Somebody should refer her to Waters; she needs his help and he needs the extra walking around money.) Looking at porn was the best decision this fellow ever made since it led to his liberation from this crazy woman. Stories like this lend credence to Archea's theory that LDS faith makes women cracked about sex.

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski

I have a good friend who is a full-time therapist. He spends most of his time dealing with addictions, porn included. He says that the porn-adultery link is greatly exaggerated. It happens, but in the vast majority of cases it doesn't.

Rather, one of the reasons guys look at porn is they are dissatisfied with their sex life, and married men may engage in adultery for the same reason. Porn and adultery may be concurrent symptoms of the same problem. But I'd say adultery probably reduces consumption of porn.

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by marsupial

going out to lunch alone with a coworker of the opposite sex.

This is more likely an actual cause of adultery than porn. Porn is a substitute for the real thing when otherwise unavailable.