1970s Church Pamphlet on Homosexuality - Page 3 - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

Indy Coug · 06-10-2008, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ERCougar

I agree with you in theory--that imperfect men are trying, in their imperfect way, to relate God's will to His church.

However, if there's something to get right, in my view, this is it. To you, me, and 95% of church membership, this isn't a big deal. We don't struggle with it, it seems to make sense that this issue is similar to anyone else's weaknesses, and that turning to God will help. To the youth who struggles with it, and then is given bad advice and/or dealt with as a "pervert", this is potentially life-wrecking.

This may be what the DSM-III was teaching, but that's no excuse for the church of God (whose leaders claim their wisdom is superior to that of the world--read the pamphlet) to get this wrong. I just don't get this.

Is engaging in homosexual behavior right or wrong in God's eyes?

Sleeping in EQ · 06-10-2008, 02:53 PM

I realize that, informally, mind and brain are treated as though equivalent, but they aren't.

ERCougar · 06-10-2008, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indy Coug

Where do you think sexual urges come from? Your ankles? Your brain processes various stimuli and formulates reponses to those stimuli. Not all brains are created equal, so people react differently to different stimuli.

Why do I even need to engage in this exercise of pointing out the stupifyingly obvious?

So...since it's just a matter of thought patterns, you could obviously choose to be a homosexual if you wanted, right?

Tex · 06-10-2008, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

????

How many teenage Mormon boys with SSA are praying to God to remove this from them. Yet God will fail them and not remove it.

"There hath no temptation taken you ..."

MikeWaters · 06-10-2008, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tex

"There hath no temptation taken you ..."

In the pamphlet the church says they can cure SSA in most cases. I wish it were true, for those LDS that wish it would be taken away.

Unfortunately, I think it's not true. And that they are ineffective. And that for whatever reason, the Lord does not answer most of these prayers to take away SSA.

Indy Coug · 06-10-2008, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ERCougar

So...since it's just a matter of thought patterns, you could obviously choose to be a homosexual if you wanted, right?

What????? Since when do we assume 100% control of all our brain functions? Can we control our heart rate just by thinking about it (spare me the Eastern mysticism examples)? Can we control the hormonal balance in our bodies just by thinking about it? Can we control any number of other functions our brain is responsible for?

Stop trying to be so ridiculously obtuse.

Tex · 06-10-2008, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

In the pamphlet the church says they can cure SSA in most cases. I wish it were true, for those LDS that wish it would be taken away.

Unfortunately, I think it's not true. And that they are ineffective. And that for whatever reason, the Lord does not answer most of these prayers to take away SSA.

There are thousands of righteous people who pray to have their disability, mental or physical, taken away. I suppose God "fails" them too.

"For whatever reason" he "does not answer" them.

Maybe I'm beginning to agree with those who say our church instruction is bland when this kind of understanding is what it produces.

TripletDaddy · 06-10-2008, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

In the pamphlet the church says they can cure SSA in most cases. I wish it were true, for those LDS that wish it would be taken away.

Unfortunately, I think it's not true. And that they are ineffective. And that for whatever reason, the Lord does not answer most of these prayers to take away SSA.

I don't think the Lord is under any obligation to remove from any of us our trials and tribulations in this life, so the fact that he does not cure people of SSA is not persuasive, at least not to me.

That being said, I also think the notion that SSA can be cured by reading the scriptures is right up there with green men on the moon. It is good to see that the Church has backed off such overly simplistic counsel and has now adopted the "let's love them and welcome them and we really don't know where it comes from" approach.

MikeWaters · 06-10-2008, 03:16 PM

Cerebral Palsy is not a sin.

Some argue SSA is a sin.

Shouldn't God be able to take away sins?

Tex, what you are in fact arguing is that SSA is a lot like Cerebral Palsy, it is (most often) an involuntary condition not easily removed. Which goes entirely counter to the pamphlet. The pamphlet says God can take it away in a majority of cases.

I don't think anyone believes that now.

Indy Coug · 06-10-2008, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

Cerebral Palsy is not a sin.

Some argue SSA is a sin.

Shouldn't God be able to take away sins?

Tex, what you are in fact arguing is that SSA is a lot like Cerebral Palsy, it is (most often) an involuntary condition not easily removed. Which goes entirely counter to the pamphlet. The pamphlet says God can take it away in a majority of cases.

I don't think anyone believes that now.

Is an urge a sin? I still have an urge to pound people who are idiots. That urge has never gone away.

06-10-2008, 02:53 PM	#22
Sleeping in EQ Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: The People's Republic of Monsanto Posts: 3,085	I realize that, informally, mind and brain are treated as though equivalent, but they aren't. __________________ "Do not despise the words of prophets, but test everything; hold fast to what is good; " 1 Thess. 5:21 (NRSV) We all trust our own unorthodoxies.

06-10-2008, 03:16 PM	#29
MikeWaters Demiurge Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 36,365	Cerebral Palsy is not a sin. Some argue SSA is a sin. Shouldn't God be able to take away sins? Tex, what you are in fact arguing is that SSA is a lot like Cerebral Palsy, it is (most often) an involuntary condition not easily removed. Which goes entirely counter to the pamphlet. The pamphlet says God can take it away in a majority of cases. I don't think anyone believes that now.