Van Halen is the greatest band of all time

[TripletDaddy]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

There is truth in this. But you need to give art at least 15 years before you can tell how well it ages, whether it is derivative or truly ground breaking and influential, and hence its true place in the pantheon. For example, when I was in HS there was not a cooler band than the Doobie Brothers. Now it should be clear they were not masterful. If I knew what I know now I'd have spent more time listening to the Beatles and the Stones than the Doobies.

Seattle, the one thing you and I can agree one now and forever is that The Beatles are the greatest of all time.

My children are not even three and they already like the Beatles.

And I bet money that their children in 20+ years will also like the Beatles. It is timeless music.

Not sure about the Stones. Check that...I am sure about the Stones.

[creekster]

Originally Posted by TripletDaddy

Do you prefer the soothing sounds of Jack Benny coming from your Victrola?

Ha, no worries. I love The Beatles. My farts are younger than yours, but I still that given overall music catalogue, longevity, and influence on pretty much everyone (musically, politically, and socially), nobody even comes close to the Beatles.

EVERYONE listens to, knows, or has a Beatles memory--for good or bad. The same likely cannot be said about the Stones. I think the drama and intrigue surrounding Chapman's assassination of John also vaulted them into mythic status.

Lennon's death probably fixed the bEatles for younger people, but they were already mythic by that time for my genreation. I was on my mission when Lennon was killed. I think in many ways his death was like JFK's death for my parents. I recall very clearly exactly wehre I was and what I was doing the day I learned the music died (I know, that song refers to somebody else, but you get the point).

[TripletDaddy]

Originally Posted by creekster

Agreed. Classic stones is great stuff.

This is why The Stones will never touch the Beatles. The Stones' catalog has tiers. Some of it is good, some of it is average, MOST of it is forgettable since they keep putting out crap and touring...conversely, there is no "classic" beatles era. The Beatles continued to evolve and redefine themselves and music. As a matter of fact, as they aged, their later albums blow away their earlier ones (would you rather listen to White, Revolver, Rubber Soul....or With the Beatles...or Meet the Beatles?).

Come to think of it, I don't even really enjoy the Stones that much. I think I like maybe 10-15 of their songs over the years.

[creekster]

But how are we to choose the greatesdt band? One consensus that seems to be emrging among us still particiapting in this thread is that VanHalen is NOT the greatest band under any criteria. True?

[RC Vikings]

After the Beetles I'm gonna throw U2 out there. Still making music after twenty five years that people buy. For the Stones if you buy "Hot Rocks" you've got most of the good stuff and that's only a period of eight years. The Who had a good run of ten years. Led Zeppelin made a big splash but faded fast. I think G n R had a chance to be great but Rose is a dumbass.

[TripletDaddy]

Originally Posted by creekster

Lennon's death probably fixed the bEatles for younger people, but they were already mythic by that time for my genreation. I was on my mission when Lennon was killed. I think in many ways his death was like JFK's death for my parents. I recall very clearly exactly wehre I was and what I was doing the day I learned the music died (I know, that song refers to somebody else, but you get the point).

Me, too. I was watching MNF with my family and Cosell dropped the bomb. My older sister cried.

I was only about 8 then, but my explained to me that John was the singer who sang all the songs we listened to in the car and he had been shot.

We would stay in NYC in the summers with our cousins and that following summer we went to the Dakota. Whenever I am in NYC, I usually wind up trying to swing by their, or now Strawberry Fields in Central Park. It is fun to read the tributes people leave to John and the Beatles from all over the world and to see the continued impact their music has on peoples' lives.

Truly, it could be argued that Imagine is the greatest song ever written.

When I went into Junior high, my mom let me read Catcher in the Rye. It has remained my favorite book of all time ever since then (sort of a sentimental favorite).

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by creekster

Lennon's death probably fixed the bEatles for younger people, but they were already mythic by that time for my genreation. I was on my mission when Lennon was killed. I think in many ways his death was like JFK's death for my parents. I recall very clearly exactly wehre I was and what I was doing the day I learned the music died (I know, that song refers to somebody else, but you get the point).

Are the Beatles the only rock band that, like Shakespeare and Woody Allen, produced brilliant early stuff, then later went on to produce their true masterworks, works of altogether greater complexity and gravity and wholly of a different kind from the early stuff? I think maybe the factor that distinguishes the Beatles is they matured as artists and actually experienced an arc in their creativity. Most rock and roll stars are like meteors.

[bluegoose]

Originally Posted by RC Vikings

I think G n R had a chance to be great but Rose is a dumbass.

Plus Slash was in a Michael Jackson video, thus disqualifying them by triplets criteria.

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by creekster

Lennon's death probably fixed the bEatles for younger people, but they were already mythic by that time for my genreation. I was on my mission when Lennon was killed. I think in many ways his death was like JFK's death for my parents. I recall very clearly exactly wehre I was and what I was doing the day I learned the music died (I know, that song refers to somebody else, but you get the point).

I was watching Monday night football.

[TripletDaddy]

Originally Posted by creekster

But how are we to choose the greatesdt band? One consensus that seems to be emrging among us still particiapting in this thread is that VanHalen is NOT the greatest band under any criteria. True?

This is a fun topic for me. I love music.

OK, I will throw out some ideas in NO order and see what the group thinks:

1. Reasonable stability within the band...meaning if you change band members every few years and wind up with a load of people who can say they were in your band, then you do not qualify.
2. Commercial success...while this should NEVER be the measure of greatness, it is usually a measure of mass and broad appeal. Kind of hard to argue for membership in the pantheon if you did not sell a lot of records
3. Touring...I dont think this should be a major criteria because it would be unfair to earlier acts (Elvis, for example) when touring was not as important. While the Beatles were likely lousy live and opted to not tour after their Candlestick show, can anyone name an iconic Stones show? The Beatles appearance on Ed Sullivan and on the rooftops on Saville Row are some of the most iconic performances in rock history.
4. Innovation....did you take music in a new direction? What did you do that was innovative?
5. Longevity.....are people still listening to your music and talking about your for good? Or are they talking about you because you stuck around for so long?
6. Influence....who have you influenced? do artists reference you as an influence?
7. Impact......did you do something to impact, for good or bad, the political or social landscape of your time and beyond?

Anyway, some thoughts.