Will Boyd K. Packer ever be the President of the church?

[SoonerCoug]

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

I genuinely wonder if Packer would abolish BYU sports. He came to our mission once and chastised the sisters for singing a song that wasn't in the hymn book. And the chastisement went on for about 12 minutes. Awkward to say the least.

I think L Tom would smack Boyd were he to touch BYU sports.

I just now realized that L Tom sounds eerily similar to L Ron.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

One of the greatest examples of how the Quorum of the twelve checks and balances the prophet was Ezra Taft Benson's pride talk, in which the first version included a condemnation of the "evils of organic evolution." That condemnation of "organic evolution" was promptly removed from subsequent versions of the talk--including the print versions. I'm certain his initial statement generated a discussion within the quorum, after which the talk was changed.

Source?

[Indy Coug]

I think we're overdue for another intellectual purge.

[Goatnapper'96]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

It still makes a huge difference who is the prophet, as far as social, political, and cultural issues are concerned.

For examples, when Darwin's theory of natural selection came out, the Church published missionary tracts arguing that this theory was very consistent with LDS principles and the restored gospel. It was fully embraced in accordance with Joseph Smith's principle of Mormonism being about searching for truth, no matter where it might be found.

100 years later, Joseph Fielding Smith sent us back into the dark ages on matters of science. Henry Eyring's father (Henry Eyring the scientist) stormed into Smith's office screaming at him when Fielding published his book "On the Origin of Man." Joseph Fielding Smith published lies and distortions about science that were propagated throughout Mormonism and are repeated in Sunday school lessons to this very day (like the purported "problems" with carbon dating, etc).

I would like to point out that President Joseph Fielding Smith's advocation and efforts with respect to BYU were huge. Before he became responsible for all church sponsored education programs, BYU was similar to Weber State. Beginning in the 50's, I think, he went on recruiting trips to encourage the Saints to send their children to BYU. He encouraged the Church to hire more credible staff and faculty and to genuinely make BYU a priority. Before that time most LDS folks not living in Utah sent their kids to the U long before the BYU. However, that trend began to change and then along came Lavell and the Church exploited the opportunity presented by the vacuum of legitimate WAC football programs and Lavell's greatness and glory. Collectively, we have enjoyed thousands if not millions of hard nipples as the glorious boys in various shades of blue have accomplished such great feats upon the gridiron specifically. So while many of you might not appreicate President Joseph Fielding's Smith rather conservative approach, let us not forget his sizeable contributions to the Kingdom's most glorious and notable artifact....BYU football!

[SoonerCoug]

Originally Posted by Tex

Source?

I have a print version of the Pride talk that was given to me by Dallin H Oaks's son. It includes a statement about the evils of "organic evolution."

Look up the pride talk on the LDS web site. No mention of evolution. They removed it.

[BYU71]

Originally Posted by Indy Coug

I think we're overdue for another intellectual purge.

If we could purge the blind obedience crowd at the same time, what would be left would be great.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

I have a print version of the Pride talk that was given to me by Dallin H Oaks's son. It includes a statement about the evils of "organic evolution."

Look up the pride talk on the LDS web site. No mention of evolution. They removed it.

Ok, just making sure your source was as reliable as I thought it might be. (Yes, that's a tad of sarcasm there.)

Is Oaks' son your source on the Nelson AIDS allegation as well?

[Goatnapper'96]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

I have a print version of the Pride talk that was given to me by Dallin H Oaks's son. It includes a statement about the evils of "organic evolution."

Look up the pride talk on the LDS web site. No mention of evolution. They removed it.

I am confused, are you saying it was in an original version but changed before the talk was uttered? I strongly believe if it was actually uttered I would have heard about it before this.

[Indy Coug]

Originally Posted by SoonerCoug

I have a print version of the Pride talk that was given to me by Dallin H Oaks's son. It includes a statement about the evils of "organic evolution."

Look up the pride talk on the LDS web site. No mention of evolution. They removed it.

Is there a reason why relatives of apostles are in a habit of circulating rough drafts of prophetic discourses?

P.S. While we're at it, does someone have a transcript of SoonerCoug's ecclesiastical confessionals?

[SoonerCoug]

Originally Posted by Tex

Ok, just making sure your source was as reliable as I thought it might be. (Yes, that's a tad of sarcasm there.)

Is Oaks' son your source on the Nelson AIDS allegation as well?

He taught my Book of Mormon class at BYU. The AIDS story with Nelson was a major news story, including the retraction and apology. I don't understand why you're skeptical about this. It's a well established fact, and these events are not infrequently mentioned by professors during classes at BYU.

I confused the Pride and the Book of Mormon talk. Compare the text on LDS.org to the original talk as given by President Benson.

http://www.lds.org/portal/site/LDSOr...____&hideNav=1

"Now, we have not been using the Book of Mormon as we should. Our homes are not as strong unless we are using it to bring our children to Christ. Our families may be corrupted by worldly trends and teachings unless we know how to use the book to expose and combat the falsehoods in socialism, organic evolution, rationalism, humanism, etc. Our missionaries are not as effective unless they are "hissing forth" with it. Social, ethical, cultural, or educational converts will not survive under the heat of the day unless their taproots go down to the fulness of the gospel which the Book of Mormon contains. Our Church classes are not as spirit-filled unless we hold it up as a standard. And our nation will continue to degenerate unless we read and heed the words of the God of this land, Jesus Christ, and quit building up and upholding the secret combinations which the Book of Mormon tells us proved the downfall of both previous American civilizations."

Organic evolution and humanism were removed, on purpose. It's no secret.