another argument for gay marriage

[RedHeadGal]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...l?hpid=topnews

I can't help but try to view this from an LDS perspective (which shouldn't be that hard but somehow is) and wonder how/why I would expect LDS people in this situation to have the opposite reaction.

Many of these former spouses -- from those who still feel raw resentment toward their exes to those who have reached a mutual understanding -- see the legalization of same-sex marriage as a step toward protecting not only homosexuals but also heterosexuals. If homosexuality was more accepted, they say, they might have been spared doomed marriages followed by years of self-doubt.

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by RedHeadGal

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...l?hpid=topnews

I can't help but try to view this from an LDS perspective (which shouldn't be that hard but somehow is) and wonder how/why I would expect LDS people in this situation to have the opposite reaction.

I don't follow the quote, but it's been a long day.

[ute4ever]

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2204636989

[Tex]

Wow, that's one of the more unusual arguments I've read for gay marriage. It may say something that they are resorting to such odd reasoning.

Reminds me of the public school handing out free condoms because, "hey, they're gonna have sex anyway, so why not make it safe?" Sure, why not provide them a free hotel room with clean sheets, too?

[RedHeadGal]

Originally Posted by Archaea

I don't follow the quote, but it's been a long day.

Well, the article is about people who entered into heterosexual marriage and then later learned their spouse was gay. And suggests that those spouses believe that if gay marriage were more accepted, their former spouses wouldn't have bothered to try to conform to the heterosexual family model, and it would have saved them from the pain this situation caused them.

I guess this topic was on my mind because I have a neighbor whom I suspect is in this situation, and recently I was wondering how and when that shoe would drop. Not really that nice of me, but it was just on my mind.

[RedHeadGal]

Originally Posted by Tex

Wow, that's one of the more unusual arguments I've read for gay marriage. It may say something that they are resorting to such odd reasoning.

Reminds me of the public school handing out free condoms because, "hey, they're gonna have sex anyway, so why not make it safe?" Sure, why not provide them a free hotel room with clean sheets, too?

Thanks, Tex, for showing me that neo-con perspective. I just don't have it, so it's hard for me to generate that reaction sometimes.

[RedHeadGal]

On another personal note, I have remembered a number of these types of stories in the LDS context (gay man marries woman, later leaves woman to life as a gay man). Seems like they came up in the 80s in the context of the growing AIDS epidemic. Or some famous book or something? Anyway, when my brother first came out to me, he was working through how he was going to live his adult life. He actually had a girlfriend at the time, and he was asking my opinion on when and if he should tell her about his SSA. (Shortly after, they broke up, and he stopped dating women). He brought up those stories and said he worried that if he chose to be with a woman, at some point he would change his mind.

It caused me to think a lot about what an LDS man in that situation is really supposed to do. I know the part about how they are supposed to be celibate, I guess, but is it supposedly okay for them to marry and attempt to live heterosexual lives? I would think that is certainly something the female partner would have to have known in that situation, but I would never, ever want that woman to enter into that relationship--it woudln't be fair to her. To either of them, really. And if he's not supposed to marry, I guess the LDS reasoning is that he has no choice but to be alone? Again, not fair. And also sad.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by RedHeadGal

Thanks, Tex, for showing me that neo-con perspective. I just don't have it, so it's hard for me to generate that reaction sometimes.

I'm willing to bet money that you can't define "neo-con" without a dictionary or Google.

Originally Posted by RedHeadGal

It caused me to think a lot about what an LDS man in that situation is really supposed to do. I know the part about how they are supposed to be celibate, I guess, but is it supposedly okay for them to marry and attempt to live heterosexual lives? I would think that is certainly something the female partner would have to have known in that situation, but I would never, ever want that woman to enter into that relationship--it woudln't be fair to her. To either of them, really. And if he's not supposed to marry, I guess the LDS reasoning is that he has no choice but to be alone? Again, not fair. And also sad.

A person that overwhelmed by his attraction for the opposite sex should not get involved in a heterosexual relationship with the expectation or hope that doing so will (by itself) change him. I think the church has made that pretty clear as well.

But, by the same token, I would say the same of a person who is unable to remain monogamous. Someone unable to control the "natural" (there's that word again) male urge to wander should not commit himself to a (semi-) permanent relationship, expecting that doing so will change him.

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by RedHeadGal

On another personal note, I have remembered a number of these types of stories in the LDS context (gay man marries woman, later leaves woman to life as a gay man). Seems like they came up in the 80s in the context of the growing AIDS epidemic. Or some famous book or something? Anyway, when my brother first came out to me, he was working through how he was going to live his adult life. He actually had a girlfriend at the time, and he was asking my opinion on when and if he should tell her about his SSA. (Shortly after, they broke up, and he stopped dating women). He brought up those stories and said he worried that if he chose to be with a woman, at some point he would change his mind.

It caused me to think a lot about what an LDS man in that situation is really supposed to do. I know the part about how they are supposed to be celibate, I guess, but is it supposedly okay for them to marry and attempt to live heterosexual lives? I would think that is certainly something the female partner would have to have known in that situation, but I would never, ever want that woman to enter into that relationship--it woudln't be fair to her. To either of them, really. And if he's not supposed to marry, I guess the LDS reasoning is that he has no choice but to be alone? Again, not fair. And also sad.

Would I want my daughter to marry a gay dude? Hell no.

For gay Mormon men, many of them likely go through an awkward period of dating women, and being confused, and not knowing what to do.

How is it going to be clear to these young Mormon women that their boyfriends are gay? Esp. if most of them have chaste relationships?

The temptation to live a deception is intense. The temptation to maintain a deception is also intense.

However, I'm not at all certain that those temptations disappear if gay marriage is legal. Especially among LDS members.

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by RedHeadGal

Well, the article is about people who entered into heterosexual marriage and then later learned their spouse was gay. And suggests that those spouses believe that if gay marriage were more accepted, their former spouses wouldn't have bothered to try to conform to the heterosexual family model, and it would have saved them from the pain this situation caused them.

I guess this topic was on my mind because I have a neighbor whom I suspect is in this situation, and recently I was wondering how and when that shoe would drop. Not really that nice of me, but it was just on my mind.

Just analyzing, it seems if legal acceptance creates greater cultural acceptance, it is possible that fewer instances of what you describe would occur. Whether it would be statistically significant, I don't know.

Within the LDS community, I don't believe national acceptance of gay marriage would somehow change cultural disfavor of the relationships, so you're likely to continue to see SSA men still go through the motions dating heterosexually. IOW, where the cultural resistance thwarts the legal acceptance, it may make little or no difference.