An indictment of single LDS men

[BYU71]

Originally Posted by TripletDaddy

Back in the early 90s, there was a talk that appeared in the Ensign (pronounced En-SIGN, not En-SUN) called "Reluctant to Marry." It was aimed at college age YSAs. My bishop gave me a copy as I was wrapping up my undergrad and entering law school. He encouraged me to read it.

Not sure much has changed and that anything unique is going on at BYU that hasnt always been going on. There has always been a push to get married at BYU. AA brought up a concern that pressures to marry have affected the social nature of casual dating. Well, that sounds about the same as when I was there over a decade ago.

Men have hormones. They would rather make out or have sex than play video games. Those that complain that they never get asked out may have a legitimate beef, but isnt it also possible that they arent as good looking as they think they are? Also, nothing prohibits women from asking men to go grab some food or go to an activity.

Sending a text instead of a phone call is less personal, but that is simply a shift in how we communicate, in general. It isnt indicative of a decline in the desire to date.

It is quite possible some of these girls aren't as hot as they think they are. Ever had a girl line you up with one of her hot friends.

I did this without looking, one time after I was divorced. She came down the flight of stairs and my heart went pitter patter, ankles to neck was great. Face, yipes.

I told her there was an awesome restaurant in Tremonton I liked. Then I had to make up an excuse when we got to Tremonton as to why I had to use a pay phone to call a friend before we got to the restaurant, (no cell phones back then).

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by BYU71

It is quite possible some of these girls aren't as hot as they think they are. Ever had a girl line you up with one of her hot friends.

I did this without looking, one time after I was divorced. She came down the flight of stairs and my heart went pitter patter, ankles to neck was great. Face, yipes.

I told her there was an awesome restaurant in Tremonton I liked. Then I had to make up an excuse when we got to Tremonton as to why I had to use a pay phone to call a friend before we got to the restaurant, (no cell phones back then).

Never let your grandmother set you up either. Her definition of "cute" is not going to be the same as your definition. In fact, "cute" may equal "butt ugly".

[BYU71]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

Never let your grandmother set you up either. Her definition of "cute" is not going to be the same as your definition. In fact, "cute" may equal "butt ugly".

True, however some grandfathers have great taste.

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by BYU71

True, however some grandfathers have great taste.

I take it you have recommended a few gals to your grandsons. Based on first-person evidence.

[TripletDaddy]

Originally Posted by BYU71

True, however some grandfathers have great taste.

Fred Thompson, for one.

[BYU71]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

I take it you have recommended a few gals to your grandsons. Based on first-person evidence.

LOL, my oldest grandson is 7, so no I haven't made any recommendations to him.

[Archaea]

Originally Posted by BYU71

LOL, my oldest grandson is 7, so no I haven't made any recommendations to him.

But if your avatar is any indication, if I were your son or grandson, I'd follow your recommendation.

[TripletDaddy]

Originally Posted by BYU71

It is quite possible some of these girls aren't as hot as they think they are. Ever had a girl line you up with one of her hot friends.

I did this without looking, one time after I was divorced. She came down the flight of stairs and my heart went pitter patter, ankles to neck was great. Face, yipes.

I told her there was an awesome restaurant in Tremonton I liked. Then I had to make up an excuse when we got to Tremonton as to why I had to use a pay phone to call a friend before we got to the restaurant, (no cell phones back then).

Isnt isnt just a question of hotness, either (although that usually is a factor). Some people that rue the lack of dating options also have unrealistic expectations, do not assess themselves accurately, and have skewed perceptions of what dating and relationships are really about. These things are more commonly known as "issues." Many YSAs in the Church have them.

If a girl at BYU is lamenting that men want to watch TV/games rather than pay attention to her, well....welcome to married life. Isnt that the lament of most married women? Work around that problem and make yourself more interesting than the video game.

But I agree with your premise, 71. What most women consider to be pretty.......yikes...

[BYU71]

Originally Posted by TripletDaddy

Isnt isnt just a question of hotness, either (although that usually is a factor). Some people that rue the lack of dating options also have unrealistic expectations, do not assess themselves accurately, and have skewed perceptions of what dating and relationships are really about. These things are more commonly known as "issues." Many YSAs in the Church have them.

If a girl at BYU is lamenting that men want to watch TV/games rather than pay attention to her, well....welcome to married life. Isnt that the lament of most married women? Work around that problem and make yourself more interesting than the video game.

But I agree with your premise, 71. What most women consider to be pretty.......yikes...

Yea, I remember my ex saying to me one time, you like hanging out with your brother more than me.

Well lets see. He likes to, golf, go to sporting events, go boating, go pheasant hunting. He is my business partner and we work together all day.

You like to get the kids together and go to your moms.

No honey, I would much rather hang out with you.

[tooblue]

Originally Posted by K-dog

What do we expect? We've empowered the women. Told them they are princesses. Told them they are valuable. Told them they are important. Told them they should be accomplished. They then go out to school and interact with a bunch of youg men told how bad, worthless, unfocused, lazy, violent and evil they are. Then we expect these downtrodden young men to approach these self-centered young women with confidence and ask them out. These guys work up the courage to send a text message (because they aren't worthy to ask in person) and the girl turns them down because she is irritated that they didn't ask in person. If she does go out with him, she finds out how meager his accomplishments are compared to hers. If he is an RM he is two years behind her in school and, although he has done what he is supposed to do, he hasn't done anything spectacular. The date goes badly as the little princess lectures our beleagured anti-hero on how great she is and how much she can do and what her expectations are (based on her Dad who she still has hero worship for). The young man not only refuses to ask her out again but swears off dating for another month, retreats into a fantasy world where he can accomplish things in a short amount of time, and finds porn a more attractive alternative because the girls on the internet aren't insisting that he be some combination of Gordon Hinckley, Paul Bunyan, Bill Gates, and Brad Pitt. Then, instead of realizing that these hands-which-hang-down need to be lifted up we send the Bishops to lecture them on their "responsibility" to ask girls out that they are neglecting and have Apostles call them out from the pulpit in priesthood session. The worst part is, it gets worse as they get older. The girls become more convinced that they are too good for the guys because everytime they talk to someone about their lack of boyfriend that person says guys "are intimidated by her because she is so accomplished and beautiful." Our little princess is increasingly full of herself and disdainful of all men. She eschews all relationships with the opposite sex except for her overly close hero worship of her father (that she has never gotten over), advances her career, expands her ego, and becomes the head of Deseret Book.

Bottom line, if these girls want to date badly enough they will ask guys out. If these girls are so hot, the top tier of guys (the .05% that they think are worthy of them) will ask them out. Until we stop trying to create superwomen at the expense of our young men, this problem will get worse.

Sounds a lot like excuse making to me.