Bronco and scheduling.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

when fans that follow college football have 1) either seen a BYU game or 2) know a one sentence summary about the team.

Based on my conversations with football fans, this is not the case, and it's never been worse, because of the lack of national TV coverage.

In-conference opponents excepted, I wonder how teams could have that said of them. Five? People watch Notre Dame. They watch USC. They watch a few others that may be at the top of their game at a given moment: LSU, Ohio State, what have you. And they may watch the Cinderella du jour: Boise State, etc.

Other than that, people watch their team, and their conference. Why would a, say ... Auburn, fan have any reason to watch a BYU game, even if every single one were aired? Or know a one-sentence summary about them?

[Indy Coug]

Originally Posted by Tex

In-conference opponents excepted, I wonder how teams could have that said of them. Five? People watch Notre Dame. They watch USC. They watch a few others that may be at the top of their game at a given moment: LSU, Ohio State, what have you. And they may watch the Cinderella du jour: Boise State, etc.

Other than that, people watch their team, and their conference. Why would a, say ... Auburn, fan have any reason to watch a BYU game, even if every single one were aired? Or know a one-sentence summary about them?

For an SEC fan, the edge of the earth begins in the suburbs of Baton Rouge.

[minn_stat]

Originally Posted by jay santos

Bronco's sold you on this "balance" concept, eh?

USC plays 12 BCS schools next year.

Playing two is "balance" for BYU.

Only 25 teams played two or fewer BCS schools this year. Balance?

We play Utah State, Wyoming, SDSU, and UNLV. And adding another D1AA to those losers is "balance"?

We think we're a top 12 team but we want to move our schedule down to the 80th best in the nation in the name of "balance"?

Although this is the perception, and it is technically correct, I haave a couple of issues with it.

One, USC is one of the few teams that actually plays more than one OOC BCS team each year. Look at Ohio State's or Nebraska's schedule for the alternative.

And while BCS technically refers to a team in one of six conferences, it is also often used to infer that a team has at least some minimal level of ability, which doesn't apply to some teams in those six conferences (Baylor and Minnesota come immediately to mind), while it does apply to some teams not in those conferences (Utah and Boise State, for example).

Take Ohio State, for example. This year, they played 9 BCS teams. More meaningful in real terms, though, they played NO top-notch teams, one good team (Illinois), three solid teams (Michigan, Wisconsin, and Penn State), two decent teams (Michigan State and Purdue), two poor teams (Washington and Northwestern), and four bad teams (Minnesota, Youngstown State, Akron, and Kent State).

By comparison, BYU (regular season) played only 2 BCS teams. But more meaningfully, they played NO top-notch teams, NO good teams, three solid teams (UCLA, Air Force, Utah), four decent teams (Arizona, Tulsa, New Mexico, TCU), one poor team (Wyoming), and four bad teams (UNLV, Eastern Washington, Colorado State, SDSU). That's plus one for OSU with good teams, plus two for BYU with decent teams, and OSU played one more poor team.

So we really played a schedule very comparable to OSU's, but they played 9 BCS teams to our 2 BCS teams, which sounds a lot worse.

I realize that to some degree, your argument follows the common perception, but the perception will never change when those who know better and have a stake in changing the perception to better match reality - CGers and the like - perpetuate the myth.

(We could quibble over where I have placed a few of these teams, but depending on the year, I basically consider the top 5-10 teams to be top-notch, good teams to be up to about 20-25, solid teams to be up to about 40-45, decent teams to be up to about 65-70, poor to be up to about 90-95, and bad to be the rest.)

[BYU71]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

how you schedule matters in terms of your radar. how you schedule matters in terms of the media exposure and what network it will be televised (if at all).

etc.

It's all tied together.

Don't you think both the scheduling thing and the Mtn thing is about how BYU feels they need to treat their fans. The national folks aren't going to give a crap about us unless we go undefeated with a decent schedule. Other than that we are a afterthought and on the radar, but a blip.

Getting the MTN on satellite isn't going to change that much either.

Bottom line is what does BYU feel they owe their fans. As long as they can fill the stadium and collect CC dues, I really don't think they feel they owe the fans much. Remember, at the head is a "religion" type mentality. You are lucky to be a part of the group. You should basically sit back, raise your right hand and sustain whatever they do.

[MikeWaters]

I am revaluating the Big 10 now. I saw a Michigan team that won despite being -4 in TOs, against Florida and it's Heisman winner.

I saw a Penn State team look fairly dominant against an A&M team that had just beat a Texas team, which thorougly embarrassed Arizona St.

I say the Big 10 is starting to look a bit better.

[MikeWaters]

Originally Posted by BYU71

Don't you think both the scheduling thing and the Mtn thing is about how BYU feels they need to treat their fans. The national folks aren't going to give a crap about us unless we go undefeated with a decent schedule. Other than that we are a afterthought and on the radar, but a blip.

Getting the MTN on satellite isn't going to change that much either.

Bottom line is what does BYU feel they owe their fans. As long as they can fill the stadium and collect CC dues, I really don't think they feel they owe the fans much. Remember, at the head is a "religion" type mentality. You are lucky to be a part of the group. You should basically sit back, raise your right hand and sustain whatever they do.

This is what I think BYU thinks about its fans and alums.

[Cali Coug]

Originally Posted by Tex

In-conference opponents excepted, I wonder how teams could have that said of them. Five? People watch Notre Dame. They watch USC. They watch a few others that may be at the top of their game at a given moment: LSU, Ohio State, what have you. And they may watch the Cinderella du jour: Boise State, etc.

Other than that, people watch their team, and their conference. Why would a, say ... Auburn, fan have any reason to watch a BYU game, even if every single one were aired? Or know a one-sentence summary about them?

If there is a game on with a top 25 team, and I have a chance to watch it, I will, and I know I am not alone.

[jay santos]

Originally Posted by minn_stat

Although this is the perception, and it is technically correct, I haave a couple of issues with it.

One, USC is one of the few teams that actually plays more than one OOC BCS team each year. Look at Ohio State's or Nebraska's schedule for the alternative.

And while BCS technically refers to a team in one of six conferences, it is also often used to infer that a team has at least some minimal level of ability, which doesn't apply to some teams in those six conferences (Baylor and Minnesota come immediately to mind), while it does apply to some teams not in those conferences (Utah and Boise State, for example).

Take Ohio State, for example. This year, they played 9 BCS teams. More meaningful in real terms, though, they played NO top-notch teams, one good team (Illinois), three solid teams (Michigan, Wisconsin, and Penn State), two decent teams (Michigan State and Purdue), two poor teams (Washington and Northwestern), and four bad teams (Minnesota, Youngstown State, Akron, and Kent State).

By comparison, BYU (regular season) played only 2 BCS teams. But more meaningfully, they played NO top-notch teams, NO good teams, three solid teams (UCLA, Air Force, Utah), four decent teams (Arizona, Tulsa, New Mexico, TCU), one poor team (Wyoming), and four bad teams (UNLV, Eastern Washington, Colorado State, SDSU). That's plus one for OSU with good teams, plus two for BYU with decent teams, and OSU played one more poor team.

So we really played a schedule very comparable to OSU's, but they played 9 BCS teams to our 2 BCS teams, which sounds a lot worse.

I realize that to some degree, your argument follows the common perception, but the perception will never change when those who know better and have a stake in changing the perception to better match reality - CGers and the like - perpetuate the myth.

(We could quibble over where I have placed a few of these teams, but depending on the year, I basically consider the top 5-10 teams to be top-notch, good teams to be up to about 20-25, solid teams to be up to about 40-45, decent teams to be up to about 65-70, poor to be up to about 90-95, and bad to be the rest.)

I agree with what you're saying.

BYU and OSU's schedule this year was very similar, and rated that way by my model and other computer models.

But a few more comments.

1. Big 10 was extraordinarily weak this year in the OOC (though they seem to be making up for it a little in bowls).
2. OSU played non D1AA, Kent State, and Akron to get to where they are--weak by all standards and they've gotten hammered for it in the media.
3. Of the major contenders, OSU had the worst schedule by far (except for Kansas), and they would have been penalized for it, if not for the crazy year of everyone losing at the top.
4. MWC was tougher than usual this year.
5. BYU played two BCS and a bowl team for 3 of 4 OOC. I consider that a reasonable approach (though still weaker than I'd like). Bronco wants to dumb it down from there. He feels he is saddled down with two BCS teams a year through 2011. He believes an OOC schedule of two average BCS schools + Utah State to be so tough he needs to balance with Utah State. That will put us much lower than this year's SOS and way below Ohio State's SOS, which already was freakishly low for a perrenial top 20 team (which is what we want to become).

[Flystripper]

Originally Posted by jay santos

Bronco's sold you on this "balance" concept, eh?

USC plays 12 BCS schools next year.

Playing two is "balance" for BYU.

Only 25 teams played two or fewer BCS schools this year. Balance?

We play Utah State, Wyoming, SDSU, and UNLV. And adding another D1AA to those losers is "balance"?

We think we're a top 12 team but we want to move our schedule down to the 80th best in the nation in the name of "balance"?

I could not have said it better myself. Preach on Jay, preach on!

[Tex]

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

If there is a game on with a top 25 team, and I have a chance to watch it, I will, and I know I am not alone.

I'm curious how many PAC-10 football fans could say they've seen a regular season Georgia game or give a one sentence summary of their team prior to the Sugar Bowl. Or West Virginia. Or Kansas.

Similary I'm curious how many SEC fans could say the same of ASU. Or Missouri. Or Boston College.