Why does Dr. Waters favor socialized medicine? - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

SeattleUte · 08-31-2007, 08:20 PM

Thoughts?

Indy Coug · 08-31-2007, 08:24 PM

Naivete?

MikeWaters · 08-31-2007, 08:27 PM

very few people support a completely non-socialized medical system.

Look at medicare and medicaid and CHIP and sCHIP.

You won't find too many people that argue against the old, the poor, and the children.

I don't think you will find too many small business owners who are very satisfied with the state of the health industry either.

Mormon Red Death · 08-31-2007, 08:28 PM

that's funny as I was going to ask him the same thing...

Doesn't he care that in National Health Insurance the government decides how much you can charge for your services? Would it be alright for the government to tell a law firm how much the may charge all their clients?

MikeWaters · 08-31-2007, 08:33 PM

More complaints that I hear:

'THEY WILL TELL YOU WHICH DOCTOR YOU CAN SEE'

Umm, welcome to 2007, most of us have been told which doctors we can see for a long time.

'THEY WILL TELL US WHICH CONDITIONS, MEDICATIONS, AND PROCEDURES ARE APPROVED.'

Umm, hello, that has been the case for a long time in the private sector.

'THE OVERHEAD OF A GOVT. PROGRAM WILL BE TREMENDOUS.'

Compare the overhead of medicare to private health insurance. It's much lower for medicare.

'IF WE HAVE GOVT. HEALTHCARE, IT WILL BE JUST LIKE THE VA, WHICH IS TERRIBLE!'

There are many problems with many VA hospitals, but there are also GREAT things at these hospitals. Tell me one place in Dallas where you can get a 30 day inpatient drug rehab stay if you are indigent. There are many examples like that. Show me one veterans group that is urging the VA hospitals be shut down and replaced with private insurance. You wont' find them.

MikeWaters · 08-31-2007, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mormon Red Death

that's funny as I was going to ask him the same thing...

Doesn't he care that in National Health Insurance the government decides how much you can charge for your services? Would it be alright for the government to tell a law firm how much the may charge all their clients?

The govt. already decides many healthcare prices. Like medicare and medicaid. Medicare makes up a big chunk of the money that hospitals get.

When a lawyer is appointed by the govt. to defend someone, does that lawyer get to choose his fee? Do those lawyers have to defend these folks? No, they don't.

I'm not advocating doing away with a private system. I just think that a public system that is high-quality may make better sense as we head towards this cliff, due to unsustainable increases of % GDP.

Mormon Red Death · 08-31-2007, 08:37 PM

Don't you see the ethical problem with National Health insurance?

they are mandating that you charge what they decide... That wouldn't bother you? why would it be ok for them to tell you what you can charge for your services but a lawyer, shoe salesman, or a grocer can charge what the market bear?

Mormon Red Death · 08-31-2007, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

The govt. already decides many healthcare prices. Like medicare and medicaid. Medicare makes up a big chunk of the money that hospitals get.

When a lawyer is appointed by the govt. to defend someone, does that lawyer get to choose his fee? Do those lawyers have to defend these folks? No, they don't.

I'm not advocating doing away with a private system. I just think that a public system that is high-quality may make better sense as we head towards this cliff, due to unsustainable increases of % GDP.

the problem is not everyone of your patients is government funded....a lawyer doesn't have to represent someone. Do you not see the difference. with National Health care there wont be a choice for you

MikeWaters · 08-31-2007, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mormon Red Death

the problem is not everyone of your patients is government funded....a lawyer doesn't have to represent someone. Do you not see the difference. with National Health care there wont be a choice for you

It's the same as public school. You are not forced to go to public school. You can go to private school if you wish, but that doesn't mean you don't have to pay taxes to the public school.

Nationalized healthcare would work the same way. You can buy private insurance and bypass the nationalized healthcare system.

By the way, doctors are very much different than lawyers and other other professionals. Doctors work for free all the time. If someone has a bad car wreck, and is taken in for surgery, the surgeon doesn't refuse to do the surgery because the patient can't pay. And no, the hospital doesn't pay the physician. It's the cost of the job.

SeattleUte · 08-31-2007, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mormon Red Death

Don't you see the ethical problem with National Health insurance?

they are mandating that you charge what they decide... That wouldn't bother you? why would it be ok for them to tell you what you can charge for your services but a lawyer, shoe salesman, or a grocer can charge what the market bear?

Why is this different from health insurers' physician networks? I don't think it's an "ethical problem." Today most any dr. gets paid for services to insured patients at a huge discount from their regular rates, and agree in wrinting to look ony to the carrier for payment. On top of that the carriers are pervasively regulated by state government. I see this as a "states rights" issue more than anything.

View Poll Results: Why does Dr. Waters favor socialized medicine?
He wants a guaranteed place at the public trough	0	0%
He's jealous of rich private practicing drs.	2	15.38%
M.D. guilt	2	15.38%
He's sincerely concerned about the uninsured poor	9	69.23%
Voters: 13. You may not vote on this poll

08-31-2007, 08:20 PM	#1
SeattleUte fairlds.org Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 10,665	Why does Dr. Waters favor socialized medicine? Thoughts? __________________ Interrupt all you like. We're involved in a complicated story here, and not everything is quite what it seems to be. —Paul Auster

08-31-2007, 08:28 PM	#4
Mormon Red Death Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Clinton Township, MI Posts: 3,126	that's funny as I was going to ask him the same thing... Doesn't he care that in National Health Insurance the government decides how much you can charge for your services? Would it be alright for the government to tell a law firm how much the may charge all their clients? __________________ Its all about the suit

08-31-2007, 08:37 PM	#7
Mormon Red Death Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Clinton Township, MI Posts: 3,126	Don't you see the ethical problem with National Health insurance? they are mandating that you charge what they decide... That wouldn't bother you? why would it be ok for them to tell you what you can charge for your services but a lawyer, shoe salesman, or a grocer can charge what the market bear? __________________ Its all about the suit

08-31-2007, 08:24 PM	#2
Indy Coug Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Between Iraq and a hard place Posts: 7,569	Naivete?

08-31-2007, 08:27 PM	#3
MikeWaters Demiurge Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 36,365	very few people support a completely non-socialized medical system. Look at medicare and medicaid and CHIP and sCHIP. You won't find too many people that argue against the old, the poor, and the children. I don't think you will find too many small business owners who are very satisfied with the state of the health industry either.

08-31-2007, 08:33 PM	#5
MikeWaters Demiurge Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 36,365	More complaints that I hear: 'THEY WILL TELL YOU WHICH DOCTOR YOU CAN SEE' Umm, welcome to 2007, most of us have been told which doctors we can see for a long time. 'THEY WILL TELL US WHICH CONDITIONS, MEDICATIONS, AND PROCEDURES ARE APPROVED.' Umm, hello, that has been the case for a long time in the private sector. 'THE OVERHEAD OF A GOVT. PROGRAM WILL BE TREMENDOUS.' Compare the overhead of medicare to private health insurance. It's much lower for medicare. 'IF WE HAVE GOVT. HEALTHCARE, IT WILL BE JUST LIKE THE VA, WHICH IS TERRIBLE!' There are many problems with many VA hospitals, but there are also GREAT things at these hospitals. Tell me one place in Dallas where you can get a 30 day inpatient drug rehab stay if you are indigent. There are many examples like that. Show me one veterans group that is urging the VA hospitals be shut down and replaced with private insurance. You wont' find them.