The Divine Institution of Marriage

[Indy Coug]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

The religious argument of course dodges the central question--the elephant in the room--do you choose your sexual preference?

Are you saying that no one ever chooses their sexual preference? Are you saying that applies to every single one of the 6+ billion people on earth?

[Jeff Lebowski]

Lots of interesting things to discuss in the article. Here is a paragraph that really puzzled me:

Finally, throughout history the family has served as an essential bulwark of individual liberty. The walls of a home provide a defense against detrimental social influences and the sometimes overreaching powers of government. In the absence of abuse or neglect, government does not have the right to intervene in the rearing and moral education of children in the home. Strong families are thus vital for political freedom. But when governments presume to redefine the nature of marriage, issuing regulations to ensure public acceptance of non-traditional unions, they have moved a step closer to intervening in the sacred sphere of domestic life. The consequences of crossing this line are many and unpredictable, but likely would include an increase in the power and reach of the state toward whatever ends it seeks to pursue.

Huh? I just don't get that one.

[ChinoCoug]

Many of these single parents have raised exemplary children; nevertheless, extensive studies have shown that in general a husband and wife united in a loving, committed marriage provide the optimal environment for children to be protected, nurtured, and raised.[6] This is not only because of the substantial personal resources that two parents can bring to bear on raising a child, but because of the differing strengths that a father and a mother, by virtue of their gender, bring to the task.

Obama has admitted that not having a father in the home has made him somewhat of a pussy.

[TripletDaddy]

With all the time and research going into these Prop 8 communications, I have noticed a suspicious absence of any data on the effect of homosexual marriage in Massachusetts...where it has been legal now for several years.

In fact, the only reference to Mass. has been the misleading adoption issue.

Does anybody know if, as some have claimed here and elsewhere, children in Mass public schools are now being indoctrinated with homosexuality? Has there been a rise of teens coming out of the closet? Has society in Mass. crumbled? What exactly has happened there that we can safely assume will also happen in California and elsewhere?

[Indy Coug]

The prospect of same-sex marriage has already spawned legal collisions with the rights of free speech and of action based on religious beliefs. For example, advocates and government officials in certain states already are challenging the long-held right of religious adoption agencies to follow their religious beliefs and only place children in homes with both a mother and a father. As a result, Catholic Charities in Boston has stopped offering adoption services.

Other advocates of same-sex marriage are suggesting that tax exemptions and benefits be withdrawn from any religious organization that does not embrace same-sex unions.[17] Public accommodation laws are already being used as leverage in an attempt to force religious organizations to allow marriage celebrations or receptions in religious facilities that are otherwise open to the public. Accrediting organizations in some instances are asserting pressure on religious schools and universities to provide married housing for same-sex couples. Student religious organizations are being told by some universities that they may lose their campus recognition and benefits if they exclude same-sex couples from club membership.[18]

Many of these examples have already become the legal reality in several nations of the European Union, and the European Parliament has recommended that laws guaranteeing and protecting the rights of same-sex couples be made uniform across the EU.[19] Thus, if same-sex marriage becomes a recognized civil right, there will be substantial conflicts with religious freedom. And in some important areas, religious freedom may be diminished.

...

[Indy Coug]

Originally Posted by TripletDaddy

With all the time and research going into these Prop 8 communications, I have noticed a suspicious absence of any data on the effect of homosexual marriage in Massachusetts...where it has been legal now for several years.

What kind of data are you looking for and what kind of credible data would you expect to see emerge from such a short time horizon?

[TripletDaddy]

Originally Posted by Indy Coug

...

Ha...you are tax a guy, I forgot.....the insurance stuff.

Please explain Catholic Charities USA to all of us.

Where does it get its funding? How much of it is directly from the state? how much of it comes from large corporations? Why doesnt the Catholic Church simply privately fund its adoption agency? And in what way is the LDS adoption situation different from the CCUSA situation?

[TripletDaddy]

Originally Posted by Indy Coug

What kind of data are you looking for and what kind of credible data would you expect to see emerge from such a short time horizon?

Anything.

It isnt hard for someone in the Church to go verify whether homosexuality is now a forced part of the public school curriculum, now is it?

Are you now of the position that there is no real way to gauge the effects of gay marriage on society without waiting for a long time horizon after such practice is legalized? If so, I would agree.

[Indy Coug]

Originally Posted by TripletDaddy

Ha...you are tax a guy, I forgot.....the insurance stuff.

Please explain Catholic Charities USA to all of us.

Where does it get its funding? How much of it is directly from the state? how much of it comes from large corporations? Why doesnt the Catholic Church simply privately fund its adoption agency? And in what way is the LDS adoption situation different from the CCUSA situation?

That's all you got from that quoted section? You completely missed the main point.

[Indy Coug]

Originally Posted by TripletDaddy

Are you now of the position that there is no real way to gauge the effects of gay marriage on society without waiting for a long time horizon after such practice is legalized? If so, I would agree.

Would you care to demonstrate where I stated otherwise before?