Deciphering one of President Hinckley's statements - cougarguard.com — unofficial BYU Cougars / LDS sports, football, basketball forum and message board

Hazzard · 02-06-2006, 07:43 PM

In the October 2001 General Conference, President Hinckley gave a talk entitled, "Living in the Fulness of Times." It was memorable for me because it is the only time I remember him specfically saying that a certain Biblical prophecy had been fulfilled. Here is the text:

'The vision of Joel has been fulfilled wherein he declared:

"And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:

"And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.

"And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke.

"The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the Lord come.

"And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the Lord hath said, and in the remnant whom the Lord shall call" (Joel 2:28–32).' (accessed at http://www.lds.org/conference/talk/d...-225-1,00.html)

I think I'm clear on how the first three verses of chapter 2 of Joel have been fulfilled, but I'm interested to hear what you think about the last two verses. Specifically, these are my questions ...

How has the sun been turned into darkness? When did this happen?

How has the moon been turned into blood? When did this happen?

How has there been deliverance in Jerusalem?

All-American · 02-06-2006, 08:10 PM

The answer that I've heard is pollution. This has darkened the sun's light and at times, the moon appears blood red as it is setting over the western horizon.

I'm not sure that this is the definitive fulfillment of this prophecy, but if no less an authority than President Hinckley says it has been fulfilled, that's the best guess I have.

Prophecy is an interesting thing, in that there may be several phases or ways wherein a prophecy is fulfilled. This is the nature of prophecy that allowed a prophecy of Isaiah to be fulfilled both when Maher-shalal-hash-baz was born as well as when Jesus was born. Israel being redeemed can refer to a) the church being established and b) the Jews returning to the nation of Israel. As neither of those two conditions have been completely fulfilled, I am led to believe that the sun darkening and the moon bloodening have not seen their ultimate fulfillment either.

In other words: they have been fulfilled, but don't change the channel just yet.

Alkili · 02-06-2006, 08:21 PM

I would say that they are symbolic. The sun is very general in that it effects the world liberally, darkness abounds in the world today. Most of these prophecies have been fullfilled in every seal of the earth.

Other versions of the same type of prophecy is that the sun will hide its face.

Blackness is a sign of sorrow or mourning.

Blood red is a sign of anger.

02-06-2006, 07:43 PM	#1
Hazzard Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 158	Deciphering one of President Hinckley's statements In the October 2001 General Conference, President Hinckley gave a talk entitled, "Living in the Fulness of Times." It was memorable for me because it is the only time I remember him specfically saying that a certain Biblical prophecy had been fulfilled. Here is the text: 'The vision of Joel has been fulfilled wherein he declared: "And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions: "And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit. "And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke. "The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the Lord come. "And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the Lord hath said, and in the remnant whom the Lord shall call" (Joel 2:28–32).' (accessed at http://www.lds.org/conference/talk/d...-225-1,00.html) I think I'm clear on how the first three verses of chapter 2 of Joel have been fulfilled, but I'm interested to hear what you think about the last two verses. Specifically, these are my questions ... How has the sun been turned into darkness? When did this happen? How has the moon been turned into blood? When did this happen? How has there been deliverance in Jerusalem?

02-06-2006, 08:10 PM	#2
All-American Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 3,420	The answer that I've heard is pollution. This has darkened the sun's light and at times, the moon appears blood red as it is setting over the western horizon. I'm not sure that this is the definitive fulfillment of this prophecy, but if no less an authority than President Hinckley says it has been fulfilled, that's the best guess I have. Prophecy is an interesting thing, in that there may be several phases or ways wherein a prophecy is fulfilled. This is the nature of prophecy that allowed a prophecy of Isaiah to be fulfilled both when Maher-shalal-hash-baz was born as well as when Jesus was born. Israel being redeemed can refer to a) the church being established and b) the Jews returning to the nation of Israel. As neither of those two conditions have been completely fulfilled, I am led to believe that the sun darkening and the moon bloodening have not seen their ultimate fulfillment either. In other words: they have been fulfilled, but don't change the channel just yet. __________________ εν αρχη ην ο λογος

02-06-2006, 08:21 PM	#3
Alkili Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Utah Posts: 263	I would say that they are symbolic. The sun is very general in that it effects the world liberally, darkness abounds in the world today. Most of these prophecies have been fullfilled in every seal of the earth. Other versions of the same type of prophecy is that the sun will hide its face. Blackness is a sign of sorrow or mourning. Blood red is a sign of anger. __________________ Dark is the Night, but I begin to see the light.