An article in SL Trib yesterday about churchy lobbyists in Utah

[MikeWaters]

and how they pressure (or don't pressure) members of the Utah state legislature.

One of the guys said he was pressured to support the gay anti-discrimination bill, but he was confused. The church was asking him to support something that they didn't want applied to themselves. Sort of a do as I say, not as I do thing.

It's really a strange time. A church that wants to pass anti-discrimination laws while at the same time lobbing anti-gay marriage firebombs in terms of rhetoric.

I don't get why "defending the family" necessitates attacking secular gay marriage. I've never understood it. People like SleepinginEQ essentially called me craven in my arguments against it. Intellectually dishonest. So wise, that one.

Why can't we stand for something positive, and just leave it at that.

[ChinoCoug]

I've rented rooms to gays, who gives a crap. I've used the women's room at KMart when I really had to go (and I didn't even cross-dress), who gives a crap.

The Church, on the hand, is screwed if it has to perform same-sex weddings or lose its tax-exempt status.

[ChinoCoug]

Mullahs in the legislature were also why the Church doesn't do anything about abortion.

[MikeWaters]

The culture wars are so ingrained in the church now, I think it's hard-pressed to distinguish the rhetoric from that of Baptists and Evangelicals.

Do we think we get extra brownie points with Evangelicals if we out-anti-gay them?

Why is this our focus? We already drive out all the gays from our congregations. We certainly don't try to reactivate them or baptize them. Why do we give a flip if they want to get married?

I'm just so sick of it. It's such a waste of time. It's a boogeyman and a distraction and completely worthless.

[ChinoCoug]

Can you post the article? Cause I don't know see how we're trying to out-baptist the baptists.

[MikeWaters]

http://www.sltrib.com/news/2343339-1...-and-beware-of

"When President Gordon B. Hinckley first read 'The Family: A Proclamation to the World' 20 years ago this year, we were grateful for and valued the clarity, simplicity and truth of this revelatory document," LDS Young Women General President Bonnie L. Oscarson told thousands of female Mormons gathered in the Conference Center in downtown Salt Lake City, with millions more watching via satellite and computers around the globe. "Little did we realize then how very desperately we would need these basic declarations in today's world as the criteria by which we could judge each new wind of worldly dogma coming at us from the media, the Internet, scholars, TV and films and even legislators."
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She was speaking at the annual women's meeting for female Mormons age 8 and up, this year designated for the first time as the official opening session of the General Conference for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

Oscarson laid out three principles in the proclamation that need "steadfast defenders" — that marriage should be between a man and a woman, that parenthood is a divine calling and that LDS homes should be "places of refuge, holiness and safety."

She issued a challenge to LDS women to defend these principles whenever they could.

"We need to continue to model righteous marriages, seek for that blessing in our lives, and have faith if it is slow in coming," Oscarson said. "Let us be defenders of marriage as the Lord has ordained it while continuing to show love and compassion for those with differing views."

[MikeWaters]

about the lobbying.

http://www.sltrib.com/news/2323383-1...-utahs-capitol