Americans views of Mormons Gallup poll

[MikeWaters]

Yes, I stand by my assertion that ETB pushed Mormons to the right. With his tirades from the pulpit, including in General Conference, where he equated the Civil Rights movement with Communism, etc.

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

Yes, I stand by my assertion that ETB pushed Mormons to the right. With his tirades from the pulpit, including in General Conference, where he equated the Civil Rights movement with Communism, etc.

He did not do that as President of the LDS Church. And I knew many very conservative Mormons who in fact disapproved of his tirades and were induced by them to reflect on their conservatism. My parents were among them. I remember once my mother said to my father, "What if he becomes the Prophet." My father replied, "We will bite the bullet." But when he took the mantle he wasn't that way anymore. Indeed, blacks could hold the priesthood, the civil rights fights were over in terms of civil unrest and high profile court battles, etc.

Mormons are conservative because they're from the sticks, they are heirs to Calvin's world view, and they are quite orthodox in their Christian/relgious faith.

Yes, Utah used to elect more democrats to higher office. Goatnapper explained why.

[Venkman]

Originally Posted by Goatnapper'96

I have often wondered if the mormon movement towards the right is too simplified in blaming ETB. If I am not mistaken didn't Utah lose a great deal of its mining industry and other historical blue collar unionized labor that had long supported the Democrat party in the 70's-80's? I also think that flat out most mormons are less appalled by right wing wackos than left wing wackos, and as has been pointed out fringe wackos in both parties has disproportionate influence.

I think there is a wing of mormons influenced by ETB that are the www.getusoutoftheUN.org wackjobs, but I don't think they really characterize the mormon culture fairly.

Both sets of my grandparents were dyed in the wool blue-collar democrats. But yet, they were deeply conservative in their worldview. The shift towards Republicans was gradual, but started back in the 60's and was in response the the huge leftward shift of the Democrat party. It was just no longer the party of FDR, and my grandparents, along with many other traditional democrats became Nixon and Reagan supporters in their later years.

[Goatnapper'96]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

Yes, Utah used to elect more democrats to higher office. Goatnapper explained why.

Fake ta-tas?

[Goatnapper'96]

Originally Posted by Venkman

Both sets of my grandparents were dyed in the wool blue-collar democrats. But yet, they were deeply conservative in their worldview. The shift towards Republicans was gradual, but started back in the 60's and was in response the the huge leftward shift of the Democrat party in the 60's. It was just no longer the party of FDR, and they became Nixon and Reagan supporters in their later years.

It is really simple to blame it all on ETB. The change in values society wide that happened in the sixties pushed many mormons towards being more conservative. I think it genuinely unfair to link it to ETB's opinions on civil rights more than LDS morality with respect to such political polarizing issues such as abortion. I also maintain that it is also partially economical in how Utah was once pretty split politically but those industries that supported Democrats are no longer prevalent in Utah.

[Venkman]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

He did not do that as President of the LDS Church. And I knew many very conservative Mormons who in fact disapproved of his tirades and were induced by them to reflect on their conservatism. My parents were among them. I remember once my mother said to my father, "What if he becomes the Prophet." My father replied, "We will bite the bullet." But when he took the mantle he wasn't that way anymore. Indeed, blacks could hold the priesthood, the civil rights fights were over in terms of civil unrest and high profile court battles, etc.

Mormons are conservative because they're from the sticks, they are heirs to Calvin's world view, and they are quite orthodox in their Christian/relgious faith.

Yes, Utah used to elect more democrats to higher office. Goatnapper explained why.

I don't know if it's so much that ETB changed his views, but by the time he was prophet, we was old and tired, and the battles he fought, like you mentioned, were over.

As my bircher father in law never fails to mention as proof of his views, Benson did testify in general conference as prophet of this worldwide conspiracy which is at the core of birch beliefs.

[Venkman]

Originally Posted by Goatnapper'96

It is really simple to blame it all on ETB. The change in values society wide that happened in the sixties pushed many mormons towards being more conservative. I think it genuinely unfair to link it to ETB's opinions on civil rights more than LDS morality with respect to such political polarizing issues such as abortion. I also maintain that it is also partially economical in how Utah was once pretty split politically but those industries that supported Democrats are no longer prevalent in Utah.

You're probably right that economics played a part, but I still think the major shift is due to the leftward social shift of the democrat party. My grandparents were still pro-union and in no way supply siders, but they just didn't feel comfortable anymore with the modern democrat party. They became Democrats who voted mostly Republican.

I agree about ETB. He had influence, but I think more than anything he reflected what many were already thinking and just affirmed their beliefs.

[UtahDan]

Originally Posted by SeattleUte

They are conservative to ultra conservative at a cellular level and you know it. Do you think I hold that against them by the way? By and large absolutely not.

I agree with all of that. I'm just saying that ETB pushed the culture even further right. Imagine the impact it would have had on the culture if Hugh B. Brown has been president of the church for example (in the other direction).

I get your editorial point that Mormons just couldn't be any more consevative than they are. I hear you. But who the prophet is can push that either direction. You have to concede that don't you?

[jay santos]

The thing that stuck out at me was the effect of Mitt Romney. 6% identified him as their first association with the church and those had a favorable view of the church. With data like that, it probably makes sense for the church to pump $100M into Romney's presidency for no other good than Mormon PR. Though of course something like that would backfire on you.

[SeattleUte]

Originally Posted by jay santos

The thing that stuck out at me was the effect of Mitt Romney. 6% identified him as their first association with the church and those had a favorable view of the church. With data like that, it probably makes sense for the church to pump $100M into Romney's presidency for no other good than Mormon PR. Though of course something like that would backfire on you.

He is a demi-god to you now but wait until the election gauntlet leaves him physically and reputationally in tatters as it did his father. De ja vu. Then it would not seem so good an investment, backfiring as you say.

Also, I think there are laws against what you are suggesting.