does anyone know how apostles are selected?

[Clark Addison]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

Who would make the "retiring" decision for a prophet? There is no precedent that I am aware of, for any calling, where the release is self-determined.

There is for the RLDS (yes, I know not their real name anymore). Their last prophet retired, although resigned is probably a better word. Or maybe "resigned under a cloud of suspicion".

[All-American]

They discussed giving apostles "emeritus" status during the David O. McKay Presidency. It's discussed in the DOM book. They decided on giving seventies emeritus status, but not Apostles.

Can you imagine any better way to inject politics into the functions of the church than by providing a way to remove members of the quorum of the 12? Yikes.

[MikeWaters]

Given there are usually 15 apostles or so, it's highly unlikely that all would be mentally incapacitated at the same time.

I still don't know what "keys" would be missing from a junior apostle that wouldn't allow the church to function.

[All-American]

Originally Posted by MikeWaters

Given there are usually 15 apostles or so, it's highly unlikely that all would be mentally incapacitated at the same time.

I still don't know what "keys" would be missing from a junior apostle that wouldn't allow the church to function.

Even when all 15 are up and running at full capacity, there's still a lot of work to be done at the office. It's a pretty intense workload-- especially considering that some of them could have retired decades earlier.

[Tex]

Originally Posted by All-American

I'm not at liberty to say much either, unfortunately. I can tell you this much: April was to be the third General Conference since the death of LeGrande Richards, and the first since the death of Mark Peterson. The church was once again under fire for employing a gerontocracy as its primary means of governance, being not so far removed from the very short tenures of President Joseph Fielding Smith and Harold B. Lee and under the presidency of an ailing President Kimball. Maybe they could have waited out one vacancy; they didn't seem willing to wait out two. President Hinckley was the major force behind the calling of Elder Nelson and Elder Oaks. How much he conferred with and worked with President Kimball when they were ordained, I honestly don't know; but I know for a fact that he was the one who interviewed, called, and, at even ordained Elder Nelson, and I believe that to be the case with Elder Oaks as well.

I think that's a critical missing piece of information. I have a hard time believing that Hinckley called two new apostles on his own authority.

However, I don't pretend to know how all the keys of the apostleship work.

Originally Posted by All-American

They discussed giving apostles "emeritus" status during the David O. McKay Presidency. It's discussed in the DOM book. They decided on giving seventies emeritus status, but not Apostles.

Can you imagine any better way to inject politics into the functions of the church than by providing a way to remove members of the quorum of the 12? Yikes.

I'll have to go back and re-read that. I admit I'm uniformed on relevant doctrinal teachings from the early days of the church pertaining to the tenure of apostles.

Joseph's death was obviously unexpected and provisions for his succession were shaky at best. When was the first time the "call for life" was taught as open doctrine?

[All-American]

Originally Posted by Tex

I think that's a critical missing piece of information. I have a hard time believing that Hinckley called two new apostles on his own authority.

However, I don't pretend to know how all the keys of the apostleship work.



I'll have to go back and re-read that. I admit I'm uniformed of relevant doctrinal teachings from the early days of the church pertaining to the tenure of apostles.

I understand that President Kimball was well enough to at least consent to what President Hinckley was doing-- in fact, I believe he was healthy enough to attend general conference in that April. But based on everything I have been able to get my eyes on, the primary actor was President Hinckley.

[RedHeadGal]

Who makes the emeritus decision for the seventies? I generally assume they make it for themselves, but maybe that's wrong.

[Cali Coug]

Originally Posted by All-American

I understand that President Kimball was well enough to at least consent to what President Hinckley was doing-- in fact, I believe he was healthy enough to attend general conference in that April. But based on everything I have been able to get my eyes on, the primary actor was President Hinckley.

I don't think that is the case. From what his son describes, President Kimball was totally incapacitated. During conference, his secretary sat next to him and raised President Kimball's hand for him during sustainings. Kimball's secretary remarked that when two conferences passed without naming a replacement for Richards or for Romney, he didn't even believe President Kimball was aware that LeGrand Richards had passed away.

President Hinckley was called as an extra counselor because Richards and Romney were suffering from Parkinson's and because Kimball was incapacitated by fluid on the brain. After his surgery in 1979, Kimball's son commented that his father wondered why the Lord wouldn't let him die, and then became progressively unaware of his surroundings until he was totally gone mentally.

[All-American]

Originally Posted by Cali Coug

I don't think that is the case. From what his son describes, President Kimball was totally incapacitated. During conference, his secretary sat next to him and raised President Kimball's hand for him during sustainings. Kimball's secretary remarked that when two conferences passed without naming a replacement for Richards or for Romney, he didn't even believe President Kimball was aware that LeGrand Richards had passed away.

President Hinckley was called as an extra counselor because Richards and Romney were suffering from Parkinson's and because Kimball was incapacitated by fluid on the brain. After his surgery in 1979, Kimball's son commented that his father wondered why the Lord wouldn't let him die, and then became progressively unaware of his surroundings until he was totally gone mentally.

Interesting. Is this generally available information, or do you know his son?

[Cali Coug]

Originally Posted by All-American

Interesting. Is this generally available information, or do you know his son?

Much of this (though not all) is in a book his son wrote (I think it is called Lengthening Your Stride, if I recall correctly).